Harry's Place

Sadly I’m not surprised by this level of vitriol. There has been an equal rise in anti semitism in most internet forums. What I find the most disturbing is the way that *some* people now state it is Israel’s actions that is ‘causing’ this hatred.

It’s an absurd conclusion to leap to. The current conflict in Gaza merely provides an excuse for those who are already anti semites – it hasn’t *created* a whole new legion of Jew haters!

However much a person may disagree with what Israel is doing, they won’t become anti semitic as a result, of that I am sure.

On another note: has anyone else noticed that the mainstream media never seems to mention the eight years of suicide bombings which Israel has suffered at the hands of Hamas? Only the rockets get mentioned.

And now for some real news (not forum troll news).

http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/249330,iraqs-prime-minister-calls-on-arab-states-to-cut-ties.html

Chavez expelling the ambassador was meant to embarrass arab leaders who still have ties with Israel.

Flankey should feel right at home at PressTV. They speak his kind of language.

“Baghdad – Iraq’s Prime Minister Wednesday called on all Arab and Muslim countries to cut their ties with Israel,…”

What a laugh Egypt is secretly and not so secretly hoping for an Israeli victory to roll back Iran’s influence in the area.

Iran and not Israel is their real enemy at the moment.

Do you think Benjamin will confirm that James’ post is anti-semitic? Or is it still ambiguous/unclear/anyone’s guess?

To the ass hole who signed himself John Malkovich
and said “Fucking JEWS!”

Malkovich has always been pro Israel.

Also the use of sexual imagery as insult is telling. These moronic Jihadist know how to die but they don’t know how to fuck. Oh I forgot fucking is what the living do and these zombies only want to kill and die.

“Is this the kind of message that is likely to get Israel to agree to a ceasefire, or is it an 11th hour attempt by Iran to scuttle it?”

In my view, undoubtedly the latter.

I suspect this whole escalation was done at the behest of Iran, certainly they have been arming Hamas. We ought be be concerned that Iran is seeking to deflect attention from her own activities, which may indicate they are closer than we thought to having a nuclear warhead.

“What a laugh Egypt is secretly and not so secretly hoping for an Israeli victory to roll back Iran’s influence in the area.”

Obvious, but the Egyptian people don’t want what that dictator Mubarak wants. So the more preassure from his people and more humilation from abroad can only push him further. Turkey, Jordan and Egypt are the targets of the move. Mauritania already did.

“Obvious, but the Egyptian people don’t want what that dictator Mubarak wants/”

Of course the Iranian people want what that dictator Khameini wants and the Palestinians in Gaza want what their Hamas overloards want.

You don’t mind dictators as long as they your dictators.

I agree, of course, but I’m wondering if there’s some meaning of the word “cesspool” according to which HP’s comment boxes don’t also fit the bill?

Want me to dig out some of Nearly Oxfordian or Morgoth’s juicier quotes?

“Mauritania already did.”

Oh yes, that democracy, the Islamic Republic of Mauritania.

Like that other democracy Venezuela. The people’s Republic of Chavez.

Mr Whip Me “I agree, of course, but I’m wondering if there’s some meaning of the word “cesspool” according to which HP’s comment boxes don’t also fit the bill?”

Got any examples of anti Arab or Muslim attacks here?

Poeple like Mr Whip Me are the real enemy. They always want to find equivalences between two opposite events.

reminds me of the BBC interviewer who said that Muslims attacking Jews is like Israel attacking Hamas.

“We muslims love to be martyr. But Jews are looser in everyside. Piety. If they die the Hell is waiting for them. They are coward they afraid to die. Alhamdulillah we kiss the death but at the same time we kill Zionist.” Islamic Mujahideen

Any one see a post that it’s the equvalent of that?

Alhamdulillah we kiss the death but at the same time we kill Zionist

Borat lives!

You’d be right to disapprove of the antisemitic content of the comment threads on CiF and IndyMedia, but surely its all in the interest of freedom of speech?

I mean, isn’t FoS the reason why you’re running a blog which has some of the worst anti-Muslim and anti-Arab content in your comments threads that can be found anywhere on the internet?

Got a post about that?

Sid,

Why don’t you provide some examples?

RE: Mauritania already did [remove its president/dictator, whatever the fuck fwanker means]. Now the Mauritanians have recalled their Ambassador in the wake of the Gaza invasion, but this too will no doubt pass. Still it’s interesting that even after the pro-Arab supposedly anti-Israel coup this summer, they still maintain relations with Israel. Must really really piss you off, boy.

“Sid, Why don’t you provide some examples?”

he can’t he is just blowing smoke.

Got any examples of anti Arab or Muslim attacks here?

Find them yourself. I doubt even the editors of this blog would deny that some comment threads drown in them.

If you really don’t know, search the comment boxes for for “John P”, “Morgoth”, “Josh Scholar”, “Nearly Oxfordian”, etc.

Perhaps the contributors to the comments on CiF and IndyMedia are oblivious or deeply ignorant of the offence of their own antisemitism. Just as some of you seem to be of anti-Muslim bigotry – which is why you’re asking for examples. It can happen.

As objectionable and islamophobic as some of the posts by John Pee and Nearly Oxfordian and Morgoth and Maven can be (and I’ve criticized them often, as have other more sensible posters on HP), they really can’t be compared to the anti-Jewish filth above that you will find on virtually any leftie web site these days. It used to be only neo-nazi sites had stuff like that. Of course, PressTV, being the voice of Iran, takes it an even lower plane.

RE: oblivious or deeply ignorant of the offence of their own antisemitism.

hey sid: which part of “The day will come when human beings terminate the jew virus of earth”
or
“inbred rodent, bloodsucking, hooknosed, pariah, jew vermin scum mother up her rathole to keep your born evil, born terrorist jew slime gutterscum “bloodline” going?”

do you think they are “oblivious” or “deeply ignorant of”?

Are you frikin’ serious?

Then of course there’s Neil Clark’s blog. Some of the comments he has approved in the last few days:

1) ‘People who target ambulances are filthy Nazi scum.

Arguably they are even worse than that – because even the Nazi SS generally drew the line at killing ambulance crews in battle!

These Zionist bastards (and all those who support them) are the utter scum of the earth.’

http://tinyurl.com/7t5jb9

2) ‘Does Israel have the right to defend itself? I don’t accept that ‘it’ does, or that it has a ‘right’ to exist.’

http://tinyurl.com/axe7f2

3) ‘The Israelis are nazi scum – they have no right to anything. Those who apologise for them, like Neil Craig, our government, the ‘Friends of Israel’, nearly all jewish organisations, the owners, managers and editors of our media – all these should be tried for aiding and abetting crimes against humanity, not to mention treason.’

http://tinyurl.com/axe7f2

And then there’s Neil Clark himself who posted this earlier today:

Viva Venezuela!

‘Venezuela has become the first country to expel the Israeli Ambassador from its country in protest over Israel’s invasion of Gaza.

The Holocaust, that is what is happening right now in Gaza,” Hugo Chavez (above), the Venezuelan president, said in televised comments.

“The president of Israel at this moment should be taken to the International Criminal Court together with the president of the United States.”

Let’s hope more countries have the courage to follow suit.’

http://tinyurl.com/8zwuae

Vildechaye – no maybe HP’s local nutters aren’t quite as bad as those Press TV comments, and Indymedia – well I wouldn’t know.

But Brett (the pot) also called CIF’s comment section (the kettle) a “cesspool”.

“These moronic Jihadist know how to die but they don’t know how to fuck.”

There’s a school of thought which argues that Jihadis are so violent because they don’t get enough sex and most of them have to get the ultimate thrill by blowing themselves and others to bits.

Whip me and Sid offer weasel answers when asked for proof.

You guys are lying.

Here is “Mr. Whip Me:”

“Mr Whip Me “‘Got any examples of anti Arab or Muslim attacks here?’

Find them yourself. I doubt even the editors of this blog would deny that some comment threads drown in them.”

Not good enough, MWM.

Either put up or shut up.

Show me anything anyone here said which comparable to this:

“James
Wed, 07 Jan 2009 21:12:02 GMT
To simon- wouldn`t your time be better spent doing your inbred rodent, bloodsucking, hooknosed, pariah, jew vermin scum mother up her rathole to keep your born evil, born terrorist jew slime gutterscum “bloodline” going?”

I dare you!

“they still maintain relations with Israel. ”

So? Venezuela still has them too, lowest level though. Heck they were pretty good up until 05 when Israel caved to Bush and damaged them.

Mr Whip Me
“Vildechaye – no maybe HP’s local nutters aren’t quite as bad as those Press TV comments, and Indymedia – well I wouldn’t know.”

If you don’t know shut the fuck up.

“But Brett (the pot) also called CIF’s comment section (the kettle) a “cesspool”.”

But you haven’t proven that the pot here is equal to the kettle there!

This is nonsense, on stilts.

Toby – since Brett has asserted without proof that CIF is a cesspool I don’t see why I can’t do the same. No, I haven’t provided evidence but I have pointed you to it. Hell, even David T (occasionally) rails against the anti-Mulsim bigots in the comments. This is commonm knowledge to everyone except you, apparently.

Ok Toby – and for that matter Brett – read this thread for instance, and then get back to me about that “cesspool” business.

Am in USA watching TV and was intrigued seeing a report on the anti Israel demos around the world captioned it anti semitic rather than anti israell. Then I realised i was watching a Christian channel. I dont know how Gene and co you put up with the bimbo news anchors.watched one on Good morning Joe particularly annoying- a Lauren Booth look-a-like and mind-alike. She was sulking cos Joe was criticising her father’s comment that B Clinton’s analysi of Arafat’s rejection was stunningly shallow. Then saw she is Miki Brezinski sp daughter of Zbigniew. Withh tightly folded arms, said, to joe, you are talking rubbish (or words to that effect). He said what exactly are you referring to. She: what you said. Everything you said. that is the level of discourse?

Stating that CiF is a cesspool and advocating, nay – praying, for the extermination of the world’s Jewry are two entirely different things. Even stating that Islam is a cruel and unusual religio-ideological entity which was invented by a Tertiary-syphilitic, child-abusing, misogynist warlord and in any literal or fundamental form has no place in the modern world, and praying for the extermination of the world’s Jewry are two entirely different things.

I wonder which of those comments is Galloway’s?

This surely can’t be true…

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/israel/4162193/Gaza-medics-describe-horror-of-strike-which-killed-70.html

Gaza medics = mad antisemites, surely…surely…

ami: “Morning Joe” is hardly a serious, hard-hitting newscast. Think “Good Morning America” for political obsessives.

No room for anti-Muslim bigotry here. One Muslim politician, at least, who seems to be worthy of respect and admiration (though people who live in France have their reservations).

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1107705/Just-days-giving-birth-French-justice-minister-work–glamorous-ever.html

Michael, that’s appalling.

Genuine question: are the Red Cross corroborating the claims in that article that they were fired upon by Israeli troops? Not saying they haven’t, but I haven’t seen those reports if they have.

Brownie, I know no more than what is reported in the Telegraph there. I haven’t seen any other reports either corroborating or rebutting this report. I think something is coming up on the Guardian website at the moment about what is being found. I haven’t read that yet.

Am in USA watching TV and was intrigued seeing a report on the anti Israel demos around the world captioned it anti semitic rather than anti israell.

They are a bunch of anti-Semites. If you weren’t constantly exposed to that euroweenie pro-terrorist news crap, you would know it.

Another “massacre” made to order just for the likes of the Jew hating Michael Rosen.

Is it Jenin all over again, Michael?

Brownie said:
“Michael, that’s appalling.

Genuine question: are the Red Cross corroborating the claims in that article that they were fired upon by Israeli troops?”

Red Cross? The article mentioned one red crescent worker.

Curious about the strike on 70 people as reported by the Telegraph and lobbed in here by Michael Rosen of “We are all Hezbollah” SWP.

No other reputable news media (including the BBC) are carrying the number of 70 given in the Telegraph report. If you read it, you’ll see that the information comes from a Palestinian medic. Such people are not allowed to speak to the press in Hamas controlled Gaza unless they are Hamas-approved informants.

The Independent, which is hardly pro Israel carries a report which states that there are no verified casualty figures for that strike. Even B’Tselem, which campaigns ardently against the Israeli army and security forces, states that the casualties are well below what the Telegraph’s reports trumpet. The fact that more than one usually pro-Palestinian source is stating that the casualty count is uncertain reflects on the credibility of the emphatic statements in the Telegraph report.

None of these reports state whether any of the people in the house were Hamas or Islamic Jihad people.The fact that no claim is made that they were all uninvolved civilians makes it seem likely that there were combatants amongst them, effectively making them human shields.

And as for the Jabalaya school strike, AP is reporting local Palestinian witnesses who saw mortars being fired from near the school at the Israeli troops and are now in fear of their lives..

Rosen tries to mock the idea that the medics might be less than reliable informants by suggesting that to question them is to label them mad anti-semites. No, it’s just that there’s a well established track record (including at Jenin, for example) of pro-Palestinian and Palestinian medics making grossly inflated claims about casualties inflicted on civilians by Israeli forces. In contrast, on the basis of their statements, you would hardly think that there was a single Hamas combatant in any of the places hit by Israeli bombings and artillery. Funny, that.

The Guardian had this “flash news report”

“Hezbollah leader condemns Israel”

Now there is news for you!

Isn’t Michael Rosen the guy who also posts at the PressTV site?

There were people there attacking someone names Michale because they said Michael is a “Jewish name.”

Looks like The Telegraoh accepts hearsay reports as factual.

That paper has become just as antisemitic as the Guardian.

There is also the chance that 70 will become 40 by tomorrow. This is often the case with these reports. And of these 40 some will then be embedded Hamas fighters. Who knows.

And there have been reports of Hamas fighters dressing as IDF soldiers. Does anyone think its completely outside the realm of possiblity that Hamas, dressed as the IDF, would murder other Palestinians? Especially ones whose politics they disagree with.

Jorge, “the Jew hating Michael Rosen.” Really? What a strange thing to say. I’ve loved almost all of my family and they seem to be Jews. I can think of many Jews I’m very, very fond of. I can’t think of any Jews I’ve hated because they are Jews. I’ve disliked and opposed all sorts of people (including some Jews) but that’s either been because they treated me badly or because they appeared to be proposing actions I thought were wrong. And now I come to think of it, some of those people I’ve disliked and opposed have been…er…jew-haters precisely because they are jew-haters! Jorge, you must try not to get your hatred of what I say muddled with your fantasies about who I am. Jews like me exist. I realise it’s infuriating for you that I do, but try not to make up lies about it and we can get on and argue about the stuff we really disagree about, eh?

Judy, others will tell you if I don’t, that I’m not a member of the SWP.

re the report. I didn’t suggest that it was anything other than what it is. You may have noticed that it’ll be hard for western journalists to corroborate the figures…now why’s that? Oh yes, I remember.

Just to put things in perspective, I took the liberty to compile a few postings not from an extremist Zionist blog, but from the mainstream Jerusalem Post. It’s the talkback to the article Arab citizens are not a fifth column. Enjoy:

2. Not a 5th column?
It’s amazing to me that since 1967, any Jew living outside the green line is considered a fanatic and an unlawful threat to peace. Yet it’s racist to suggest that Palestinian settlers in Israel proper (aka Israeli Arabs) should actually show some loyalty to the country in which they have full citizenship & voting rights. If Israeli Arabs really want to be treated as equal citizens, they should be subject to the draft and other obligations of citizenship. If they don’t want that, no one is forcing them to stay.
Daniel A – USA (01/04/2009 08:06)
NOTE: The Druze and the Bedouin serve in the IDF; Haredi Jews don’t serve; and Jews who do serve are not volunteers, but are forced by the State to do military service.

10. NO, JUST AN ENEMY IN YOUR MIDST
Make no mistake – Israeli Arabs will cut your throats if given the chance. The JP should publicize the epidemic of stabbing by Israeli Arabs of Jews. Everyone knows about this but no one will speak of it. It’s like black crime in the US.
abe – usa (01/04/2009 10:23)

14. fifth column
go live w/ your brothers in the 22 Arab/Muslim countries and complain about your “plight”. get out of Israel if you cannot support her 100% in time of war.
Michael – (01/04/2009 11:02)

22. ‘Israeli’ Arabs ARE 5th column, should be expelled
Of course they ARE a fifth column. THey should be expelled, especially during future wars which (unfortunately) will take palce within Western Eretz-Yisrael. Israel cannot be a vaible state as long as there are large concentrations of Muslims west of the Jordan. In fact Israel needs (and deserves) some of our ancestral land tracts east of it, too. Some loyal Arabs should be allowed to stay, of course.
Benjamin Norbert – USA (01/04/2009 12:33)

57. Israeli Arabs are not a Fifth Column?
Are you an Israeli Arab? Are you a Muslim? Does not your religion teach you specifically LIE and say anything to further the cause of Islam? And non-Muslims should believe you? On what evidence?
dan – usa (01/04/2009 19:00)

48. Arabs are a 5th column
People who want to live at peace with neighbors does not support genocidal Arab terror. However, from their Arab perspective, they feel a solidarity with Arab terror just because they are Muslims too. Few Jews will support criminal Israelis. We cannot tolerate Arabe moral depravity.
Frank – Canada (01/04/2009 18:14)

psst, shmuel, come over here a mo, I’ve got a secret to tell you….I’ve heard that some of the planes flying over Gaza are actually piloted by Hamas fighters who are bombing their own people. Really. It’s true. Incredible but true.

toby, have you got the links to my posts at pressTV? I don’t remember writing anything there but you clearly do. Perhaps it’s Rabbi Michael Rosen? Or the ‘radical sex photographer’ Michael Rosen. Or even the Broadway actor Michael Rosen who’s just opened in West Side Story. Or even Michael J. Rosen who has exactly the same profession as I do, but just happens to have nearly the same name, he from Ohio, me from London. (just trying to help out, as I can see you’re interested in facts here)

“70 dead in Zeitoun strike” — the story has now disappeared from the Telegraph online. Seems to have been a fabrication that fooled no one except a gullible Telegraph hack in Jerusalem and one or two people in London who wanted to believe it was true.

Michael Rosen “Jorge, “the Jew hating Michael Rosen.” Really? What a strange thing to say. I’ve loved almost all of my family and they seem to be Jews.”

Yes, I know Michael Rosen. Some Jews makes the best antisemites.

Too many examples to list here. You might want to read Jewish self hatred by the non Zionist psychologist Sander Gilman.

He offers lots of good examples going back to the 16th century:

“Jewish Self-Hatred: Anti-Semitism and the Hidden Language of the Jews”

http://www.amazon.com/Jewish-Self-Hatred-Anti-Semitism-Hidden-Language/dp/0801840635/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1231384249&sr=8-1

For his other work see this:

http://www.amazon.com/s?ie=UTF8&keywords=sander%20gilman&index=blended

Now, I don’t believe in the idea of Jewish self hatred. Jews who hate Jews hate other Jews but they often tend to love themselves.

Wether you include your family in your hatred of Jews that your own private business. But your public behavior shows you Jew hatred pretty clearly.

Hasbarah Buster is back.

This is a typical antisemitic formula: make it seem as if the Jews/Zionists are condemning themselves.

It goes back to the Christian Gospels. Leave it to an Argentinean bigot to employ hackneyed rhetorical techniques to attack Jews.

Hey Yusuf shouldn’t you be posting on Press TV?

Btw: tell us again about the murder of the hundreds of Argentinean Jews by Iran.

And what about the disappeared? I great number of them where Jews too.

And when will you be making restitution to the indigenous people of the Argentine. Oh I forgot you killed them all. I suppose that makes an expert on genocide. You kill off the Indians you kill leftist Jews and now you go after Zionists.

Go fuck yourself.

This is what our Argentean pogromchik “Hasbara Buster” keeps not mentioning. He doesn’t want to talk about the Jew hatred in his own country, a hatred in which he participates:

From the BBC:

“Argentina marks 1994 bomb attack” (Note: it’s 15 years and counting)

“Argentines have been marking the anniversary of the 1994 bombing of a Jewish centre in Buenos Aires that left 85 people dead and about 300 injured.
Thousands of mourners gathered to honour the dead and called once again for investigations to be stepped up and those responsible brought to justice.

Nobody has ever been convicted, but the current government has said it is determined to secure justice.

A prosecutor last year blamed Hezbollah for the blast, which the group denied.

A siren sounded at the precise time the bomb exploded at 0953 (1253 GMT).

People lit candles, laid roses and held aloft photographs of the victims as the names of the 85 dead were read out.

The blast on 18 July 1994 reduced the seven-storey Jewish-Argentine Mutual Association (AMIA) community centre in Buenos Aires to rubble.

The scale of death and destruction left Argentina’s 200,000-strong Jewish community, Latin America’s largest, in shock.

“We were looking for justice but we found impunity,” read a large banner at Tuesday’s ceremony.

Luis Czyczewsky, whose daughter died in the blast, called for more to be done – not only for the crime to be solved but for Argentina to take a stronger stance against terrorism.

“Today we are left with a sense of impotence, with our anger,” he told the crowd.

“Once again, impunity is winning the battle.”

Unsolved

Over the years, the case has been marked by rumours of cover-ups and accusations of incompetence but little in the way of hard evidence.

Minor figures, including a policeman who sold the van used in the attack have been named, but no-one has been convicted.

Many accused previous governments of doing too little to find the perpetrators. “

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/5190892.stm

The current administration of President Nestor Kirchner has expressed a firm desire to produce results but so far there has been little obvious progress, says the BBC’s South America correspondent Daniel Schweimler.

Mr Kirchner’s cabinet chief, Alberto Fernandez, said that the courts would do all they could to find the attackers.

Members of the US-based World Jewish Congress (WJC) were to meet the president after the commemorations to add their voices to calls for the authorities to do more.

Local Jewish groups have long said the bombing bore the hallmarks of Iranian-backed Islamic militants.

Iran has repeatedly and vehemently denied any involvement in the attack.

Last November, an Argentine prosecutor said a member of the Islamic militant group, Hezbollah, was behind the attack and had been identified in a joint effort by Argentine intelligence and the FBI.

But Hezbollah said that the man, Ibrahim Hussein Berro, had died in southern Lebanon while fighting Israel.

The 1992 bombing of the Israeli embassy in Buenos Aires, which killed 29 people, also remains unsolved.”

Don’t talk to me about the Israel-Palestinian conflict, fuck head, talk about Argentinean attacks on Jews.

Michael Rosen
“psst, shmuel, come over here a mo, I’ve got a secret to tell you….I’ve heard that some of the planes flying over Gaza are actually piloted by Hamas fighters who are bombing their own people. Really. It’s true. Incredible but true.”

Aren’t you cute, Michael.

Did you hear this joke from Ahamdinejad of from Nasrassalah the people you love to associate with?

Flanker@7/10 10:18

Obvious, but the Egyptian people don’t want what that dictator Mubarak wants. So the more preassure from his people and more humilation from abroad can only push him further.

So, what you’re saying is that despite commanding the Egyptian AF in ‘73, weathering some serious attempts by Gamaa’ah, Jihad and Takfir wa’l-Hijra during the late 80s and early 90s to destabilise his regime and assassinate him, an uber-loyal military command and those above NCO level in the police, succesfully outwitting the MB at every turn by adopting their social welfare ‘loyalty’ policies, every Egyptian to a man comparing him to Sadat (who everyone has a poster/picture of somewhere) for the last 30 years and at the same time hating his guts…despite all this and lasting this long, the poor man’s going to be ousted?

Don’t be so sure that the long-suffering Egyptian people won’t put up with al-Manufi for a bit longer (he’ll stand down at the next election), or even his son Gamal.

Protests in Egypt haven’t been nearly as well supported as the MB and anarkos here would like to believe: the man on the street is anti-Hamas and has had enough of Palestinian whingeing. You see, many Egyptians have worked or know someone who has worked in the Gulf or Saudi. This way, lots of people, either through second hand reports or first hand experience learn just how cushty life can be for the Sons of Goliath: special tax rebates, subsidies and welfar payments are the preserve of ex-pat Palis. in countries like Saudi. Your average hard-working Egyptian is none too impressed with their ’special’ status.

I like Mubarak. He’s been unfairly criticised in my view after landing in one of the most impossible jobs in politics. After the idol-worship of Nasser and the similarly enduring cult of Sadat, the next incumbent was always going to have a tough job. But, slowly but surely, from the debt-laden economy of the 80s to major macro-economic restructuring in the 90s through to continued democratic reform since 2000, Mubarak has managed to largely weather the storm and steer Egypt to an average 5% AGR, a tenacious stock and securities market and investment pouring in, particularly into the IT and construction sectors. Sure, there are still major obstacles ahead, not least demographics and social unrest largely caused by the fall in real wages, but I think Egypt has a bright future.

If anything, the man’s a hero to all those who oppose rabid Islamist violence. When it mattered, he cracked down HARD. No pussyfooting about. And it worked: apart from sporadic attacks like Hatshepsut, Taba and Dahab in 06, Egypt is as safe as houses.

No. Mubarak’s here for a while longer I’m afraid.

Michael don’t play stupid.

You are posting on a thread that deals with the antisemitism of anti-Zionists and in one of those web sites they talk about Michael being a Jewish name.

Whether you were there or not is immaterial. I was pointing out the kinds of people you associate with.

People who yell comments like “got o the ovens” at pro Israel demonstrators.

Or this one from Press TV:

Michael(UK) “Wed, 07 Jan 2009 23:01:38 GMT
I don’t think my opinion will change tomorrow. Now be a good Jew , toddle off and gas yourself.”

You may not have said this and you may not have been there at all but like it or not they speak for you too.

Love his poetry and he seems a nice guy…shame about his politics!

Hi Michael,

here’s my reply to your last post to me:

“z., I wasn’t ‘foisting it on you’. I was reminding you of what you know very well is a fairly familiar position of plenty of zionists.”

You were sticking on me a view (actually indistinguishable from your view, embedded as it was in a polemic of your own) I did not express, presumably because you thought (correctly, as it turned out), the more extraneous verbiage you swamp me with, the more difficulty I will have addressing it.

“How nice of maven to express it here at Harry’s Place just as nice zionists like Gene explain why poor little Israel is just doing what reasonable nation states have to do.”

I am not Maven, or Gene, or Fabian. In your last post (your imputing to me the views of Maven) you raised the issue of settlements. Well, that is indeed a problem, which merits discussion, but it is probably more detailed than my wrists can cope with now.

But, briefly, I think Jewish east Jerusalem should and will stay, the Jewish quarter of the old city retained by Israel. Ariel is the main problem. I have some sympathy with the view that the settlements post-’67 constituted ‘colonialism’, but, again, I do not think it ‘as simple as that’, for various reasons, not least of which I think it perfectly just for Jews to wish to settle in all parts of eretz yisroel and understandable that they did so when they had the chance. However, now, except for Jewish east Jerusalem, most should go.

The reasons I think the latter I will be happy to explain when my wrists are a little rested.

“”Z.: “I think he means that you only (allegedly) identify or assert your Jewish-ness negatively, in contradistinction to the Jewish state of Israel, Zionism or those sympathetic to either.”

“Rosen” Ah, Z., (or Fabian) you’ve become Gilad Atzmon.”

Well, given your ability to transmute me into Fabian or Gene, it comes as no surprise you may work your magic and transform me into Gilad Atzmon.

“Rosen: Excellent. This indeed is what Gilad has been patiently trying to explain to the likes of me. Good, glad that’s been sorted out.”

a) I didn’t say it of ‘you’, Michael, I said what I think Fabian meant by ‘asaJew’.

I gave the example of a Bolshevik Jew, and the hypothetical example of a Jew who only defines his Jewishness negatively. Analogous to a Christian Jewish convert, perhaps.

But, congratulations, the more your impute to me what I did not say, the more you exhaust my ability to address it.

b) since when does the (alleged) coincidence of some element of what one (allegedly) says make one into someone else allegedly saying it?

Even a stopped watch, as they say, is right twice a day. Could one not allege there is a coincidence of view between you, Atzmon and Israel Shamir? Does that make you either?

“a) I didn’t say it of ‘you’, Michael, I said what I think Fabian meant by ‘asaJew’.”

Although, once again, I am only going on what you’ve told me.

“the story has now disappeared from the Telegraph online.”

Incredible but true.

(-and-)

“Soldiers are facing Hamas gunmen fighting out of uniform or even, in some cases, clad in stolen IDF uniforms…Hamas gunmen are commandeering ambulances and taking children out with them to battle…”

Psst. Michael. May borrow your particular manner of condescension for a moment? (A kind of condescension peculiar to those who make a living talking to children I’d speculate.) Regardless, thanks so much. Sounds like the job of journalist reporting on Gaza is pretty straightforward these days. Don’t you agree?

Sidney:

I mean, isn’t FoS the reason why you’re running a blog which has some of the worst anti-Muslim and anti-Arab content in your comments threads that can be found anywhere on the internet?

From the man who had to shut down a thread on Pickled Politics in which he called the first days of this conflict “a holocaust” and wondered why the comments box filled up with genuinely antisemitic bile.

It was actually quite convenient for him I suppose, as it saved him having to defend such a ridiculous statement.

But glass houses, stones and all that…

This is for Michael Rosen”

Bob Dylan’s Zionist Song:

“Well, the neighborhood bully, he’s just one man,
His enemies say he’s on their land.
They got him outnumbered about a million to one,
He got no place to escape to, no place to run.
He’s the neighborhood bully.

The neighborhood bully just lives to survive,
He’s criticized and condemned for being alive.
He’s not supposed to fight back, he’s supposed to have thick skin,
He’s supposed to lay down and die when his door is kicked in.
He’s the neighborhood bully.

The neighborhood bully been driven out of every land,
He’s wandered the earth an exiled man.
Seen his family scattered, his people hounded and torn,
He’s always on trial for just being born.
He’s the neighborhood bully….”

http://orad.dent.kyushu-u.ac.jp/dylan/neighbor.html

“From the man who had to shut down a thread on Pickled Politics in which he called the first days of this conflict “a holocaust” and wondered why the comments box filled up with genuinely antisemitic bile.”

sidney or michael, these poor pathetic folk sleep with dogs and wander why they wake up itching all over.

“Soldiers are facing Hamas gunmen fighting out of uniform or even, in some cases, clad in stolen IDF uniforms…Hamas gunmen are commandeering ambulances and taking children out with them to battle…”

Not doubting this but how do we know this is true? Any vids of the Hamas doing what you say. Need to know to tell my friends what is going on here

Here is a video of bob dylan’s “NEIGHBORHOOD BULLY”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlHlXHimo_g

Hasbara Buster: None of the quotes from JP or wherever you got them from, as bad as they are, even come close to what is quoted from Press TV. But this is your little tactic isn’t it. The moment there is a valid criticism of Israeli foes, you devote yourself to finding some vaguely parallel Israeli fault in some vain attempt at equivalence. It’s quite pathetic, and you sound like a broken record.

Busting the Hasbara Buster: GIve it a rest already. Your argentina obsession is wearing thin, and you’ve become about as tedious as HB.

vildechaye, you don’t know how to read, do you, wild beast?

None of the quotes from JP or wherever you got them from, as bad as they are, even come close to what is quoted from Press TV.

Please take into account that JP moderates comments. These are mainstream quotes from the Israel-supporting community.

And things are very fucked up when mainstream voices say things like “Israeli Arabs will cut your throats if given the chance,” don’t you think?

Another nice quote from a man who got 23% of the votes in the Likud primary:

“Why should non-Jews have a say in the policy of a Jewish state? (…) You can’t teach a monkey to speak and you can’t teach an Arab to be democratic. You’re dealing with a culture of thieves and robbers. Muhammad, their prophet, was a robber and a killer and a liar. The Arab destroys everything he touches.”

http://www.newyorker.com/archive/2004/05/31/040531fa_fact2_a?currentPage=4

If this person is not expelled from Israel’s largest party — do the Palestinians have a partner for peace?

mike in java

“Not doubting this but how do we know this is true? Any vids of the Hamas doing what you say. Need to know to tell my friends what is going on here”

Here

That didn’t work right…

Here

Scrat, I was referring to comment that Hamas were dressed as IDF soldiers and the video you refer to could be (I say could) be an armed man taking a child to a point of safety..forever questioning!!

By the way another site to read – thanks.

HB, the Likud ain’t the largest party in Israel by a pretty fair margin. It might be after the elections, but it sure isn’t now.

Feiglin was also de facto kicked out, at least in terms of running for a place in the knesset.

Besides, what do you have against racists? You and Feiglin could easily reach an understanding.

Sorry Mike, I hadn’t read the whole thread. Hey, that rhymes.

But if you look at the other vids on that utube site, there seems to be numerous instances caught on video.

Saving the kids life, or using him as a shield? Green grass or beetle’s dung?

A ‘local nutter’ responds:-

As objectionable and islamophobic as some of the posts by John Pee and Nearly Oxfordian and Morgoth and Maven can be

It seems I have to re-state for the record that I harbour absolutely NO Islamaphobia in my body or thoughts. Am I anti-Islamist and anti-Hamas? Absolutely, just as some of the main people at HP are. Is it “Islamaphobic” to criticise Islamists who would manufacture hatred towards Jews?

I have said MANY times that ordinary Muslims (Joe The Muslim if you will) just want to live in harmony with us. There are some in the Muslim community who do harbour hatred towards Jews and I will say whatever I like about them without casting against Joe The Muslim as if they also hold the same views.

Nothing in the Jewish/Israeli community compares with the hatred and bile we see not only from press.tv but also various Islamist web sites in the UK. Compare MPAC UK with HP for example. HP looks more like the WI compared to Islamo-Nazis at MPAC UK. What skews this is that refugees from MPAC seem to infest debate here and rightly get a response. That’s because we are an open posting system which credits HP. Try and argue with MPAC UK via their comments section and you won’t get through.

Mike, be a mench, ask ummah.org if you can swap places with Amy on the list. On the other hand if you are BOTH on the list then there’s not a lot you can do.

However, I believe the criteria was ‘prominent Jews’ so maybe they will miss you in this sweep.

It seems to me that you are fiddling while Jews are waiting to be burnt again.

What’s your solution to the news that Hezbollah just perpetrated another Act of War against Israel by firing rockets at it. Shall Israel just build bigger bomb shelters? Maybe they need a huge sky dome.

BTW – as a Jew aligning with anti-Israel sentiment do you get a special badge labelled “Dhimmi – do not kill!”

I suppose what I’m saying is that people want to kill you Michael for simply coming out of the wrong womb so how about spending some time arguing against those who want to do that while Israel fights against those who have the same idea.

RE: You don’t know how to read.

your posts are unreadable. i guess nobody’s had the heart to tell you till now.

So in a comments threadabout anti-semitic comments on PressTV Michael Rosen posts a link to a news article on the UN school bombing??

Good work Rosen. The school bombing is covered in about 8 other threads on this site, but we cannot have one discussing Islamic anti-semitism can we?

If you have nothing to say on the matter at hand Michael perhaps refrain from posting….rather than making a blatant, immature and sad little attempt to change the topic?

What an unpleasant dishonest little man you are.

On other threads on HP recently I answered your points and challenged you. Each time you ran away.

Judy (above) made a correct rebuttal of your rather lame post. Saves me the bother.

Now go away and wrirte for some adoring three year olds please little man. Of course if you actually want to comment on the topic at hand…feel free. If you just want to remind us that you are around….well, we know. We are all delighted.

MattG

And now missiles hit northern Israel, no doubt it won’t take long for people to rush to excuse Hezbollah or any other “militants” who fired them.

May the Guardian of Israel protect the People of Israel in the Land of Israel, and around the world, and may He thwart the plans of those seeking to harm Jews.

The time will come when those who hide their hatred behind all sorts of political rationalisations will bow their heads in shame, when they realise just how much they debased their moral judgement in the service of prejudice.

Maven

“What’s your solution to the news that Hezbollah just perpetrated another Act of War against Israel by firing rockets at it. ”

Ooooooh,I like this one. Can hazard a guess or two:

1) It was Mossad

2) Its a Lie

3) Give us a few days and we’ll come up with something better -understandable rage of the ‘noble savage’ etc etc

mattG

Press coverage can indeed be depressing. Check out the all-too typical headline from “The Independent”

“Israel ‘fires into Lebanon after rockets’

Which is an absurd headline based on the circumstances as the real story here was that rockets were fired into Israel from Lebanon. It reminds me of the BBC headlines I used to see during the last Intifada…things like “Palestinians wait in fear for Israeli retaliation” when the story was actually a suicide bomber killing 25 people or something. It is part of the attempt by some parts of the media to make Israel seem like the actor and Palestinians the reactor. What I find even more sickening is the Guardian which now wants to pretend that Israel’s seat of power is Tel Aviv. From today’s website…
“Gaza diplomatic efforts near deadlock
US urges Tel Aviv to say yes to ceasefire call while UN security council debates action to end crisis ”

The capital of Israel, regardless of what you think of the country, is in Jerusalem. The Knesset is in Jerusalem. The cabinet meetings are held in Jerusalem. In West Jerusalem well within the Green Line I might add.

May the Guardian of Israel protect the People of Israel in the Land of Israel

If that’s like the Times of India then I wouldn’t hold your breath.

HB links to an article that’s four years old and thinks he has said something new. What an ass hole.

The Jew hating HB needs to stop writing about Israel a country he knows nothing about and to tell us about his own country Argentina.

Tell us about the progroms against Jews in Buenos Aires where hundreds of Jews were killed in separate bombings a few years back.

What was your role in that?

Michael Rosen is one dude in search of a massacre with which to blame Israel.

He is not the only one. There is a video of a Gaza explosion that killed many people. Those who posted it blamed Israel for the deed.

It turns out that the video is of a Hamas “work accident” where they were carrying deadly rockets which exploded and killed a number of people.

You can see it here:

“Raw; (2005) Hamas Weapons Parade Accident Kills 15, including kids

CLOSE [X] Initially believed to be new footage from the current events in Gaza information has come to light that this media is in fact from 2005 although it seems to have only been released in this particular form recently.

Hamas parades weapons in Gaza, they blow up, killing 15, including kids
By israelinsider staff and partners September 23, 2005

Dead and wounded at the Hamas ral More..ly. Parading homemade weapons can be dangerous. (AP)

A pickup truck carrying masked militants blew up at a Hamas rally on Friday, killing at least 15 Palestinians and wounding 80, The PA Interior Ministry confirmed.

Witnesses said the truck carried homemade weapons, and Palestinian security officials said the blast apparently was caused by the mishandling of weapons. Hamas blamed Israel, saying Israeli aircraft flew overhead during the rally. Israel denied it was involved.

Seven of the wounded were in serious condition, hospital doctors said.

The rally was held in the Jebaliya refugee camp. Witnesses said participants crowded around the pickup truck carrying militants when the explosion went off. The witnesses said the truck carried homemade weapons.

One man, who only gave his first name, Hussam, said he helped pull three men out of the pickup, two dead and one man who was still alive, but had a leg severed. The side of the pickup was charred.

The witness said he saw five dead children nearby. Dozens of children were wounded in the blast. The Hamas military wing, Izzedine al Qassam, is popular with youngsters. When the pickup with the gunmen arrived at the rally, many children crowded around the vehicle.

After the blast, men carried bloody body parts and lifeless bodies wrapped in blankets to nearby cars.

The dead and wounded were taken to nearby hospitals. Doctors initally said they had a total of 56 wounded at two hospitals, but Hamas later revised the figure to 45 wounded. The toll was later revised upward again on Saturday, to 140.

At Shifa, doctors had to treat patients on the floor of the emergency room because they ran out of beds. Masked Hamas men wheeled in casualties, including children…..”

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=3b3_1230864719

So, Michael Rosen and his ilk will have to wait a little longer for their “Israel massacre.”

Jorge,

From the article:

“We had to leave about eight injured people behind because we could not get to them and it was no longer safe for us to stay.” Mr Shaheen was in a convoy led by a jeep from the International Committee of the Red Cross that made its way down war-damaged tracks past demolished houses to the town of Zeitoun.

And:

“I could see an Israeli army bulldozer knocking down houses nearby but we ran out of time and the Israeli soldiers started shooting at us.

So they were part of a convoy headed by a Red Cross jeep and were apparently shot at by Israeli troops. Hence my question about whether the Red Cross have corroborated reports that they were fired upon.

To “Sid and his holocaust” (is that you Morgoth?)

It was actually quite convenient for him I suppose, as it saved him having to defend such a ridiculous statement.

It wasn’t my statement to defend. It that of a Gazan citzen who made it after the first day of bombing on Saturday 27 December, in an interviewed by al-Jazeera. I think that after 40 years of life in a refugee camp and last March’s attacks by Israel, Gazan civilians might be forgiven for believing they’re being subjected to a genocide.

And yes we closed the thread down because of the anti-semitic comments, most of which we were deleting anyway. When has that ever been the case here when threads threaten into turning into “cesspits” of anti-Muslim bigotry?

But glass houses, stones and all that…

Yep, I’d say that that’s a perfectly apt statement to come up with to describe the original post by Brett.

sorry, “cesspools”.

I really must apologise for saying Michael Rosen was a member of the SWP. I now recall that he was not just a member but stood as an MEP candidate for the even more off the wall celebrity Trotskyite sect “We are all Hezbollah” Respect, led by George Galloway. Perhaps he’ll let us know which particular bit of Trot sectarian wreckage he’s now clinging to, whilst trying to suggest here that people who draw attention to the well established mendacity and faking of Iranian financed terror groups like Hezb and Hamas are given to spreading absurd false reports about Hamas dressing up as Israeli pilots to bomb their own people.

As is well, established, Hamas doesn’t hesitate to summarily execute its opponents in Gaza when they’re in hospital or store ordnance under civilian homes. It doesn’t feel the need for those subterfuges. On the other hand its operatives do have a track record of dressing as Israeli soldiers when they’re out to blow people in Israeli restaurants to pieces.

I’m sure they’re deeply touched that Michael’s on their side, defending them against the evil genocidal zionists.

(is that you Morgoth?)

Check the IPs. I only ever post under my real nom-de-guerre. Apart from when I’m taking the piss out of someone more than normal.

“But glass houses, stones and all that…

Yep, I’d say that that’s a perfectly apt statement to come up with to describe the original post by Brett.”

I’d be interested if you could find a comment thread that we’ve allowed to stand where a person has suggested exterminating Arabs or Muslims as “vermin” and “viruses” or where language akin to “hooknose” has been allowed to refer to any race, and, more to the point, where this type of comment has dominated the thread and solicited general agreement from the other commenters.

You likened the comments on CiF and IndyMedia to an “antisemitic cesspool” then went on to highlight far more deleterious antisemitic comments on PressTV, thereby making a direct equivalence.

If you’re arguing on points of degree here, are you suggesting that the anti-Muslim bigotry in the comments on this site is less offensive, in terms of tone and content, than the antisemitic bigotry on CiF and IndyMedia? Or are you simply unable to make a direct equivalence between a site which is loaded with anti-Muslim bigotry in its comments to a “cesspool”?

“If you’re arguing on points of degree here, are you suggesting that the anti-Muslim bigotry in the comments on this site is less offensive, in terms of tone and content, than the antisemitic bigotry on CiF and IndyMedia?”

This is stretch.

YOu have been asked for examples of anti Muslims bigotry and you are offering weasel analogies.

Examples, please, or shut the fuck up, Sid!

“shut the fuck up” because you don’t know anti-Muslim bigotry when you see it or “shut the fuck up” because you don’t want your monopoly of grievance disturbed?

The attempts to emotionally blackmail critics of Israel are pretty desperate. This ‘Toby’ nutter posts a comment by another nutter called ‘Michael’ that he read on another forum:

Michael(UK) “Wed, 07 Jan 2009 23:01:38 GMT
I don’t think my opinion will change tomorrow. Now be a good Jew , toddle off and gas yourself.”

Toby then addresses Michael Rosen (an entirely different Michael from the one who posted the anti-semitic comment) thus: “You may not have said this and you may not have been there at all but like it or not they speak for you too.

It’s a bizarre formulation ‘catch all’ formulation, which boils down to this: critics of Israel are secret Nazis. If you are a Jewish critic of Israel, like Michael Rosen, you are a self hater and/or a Nazi.

That Zionists have to rely on such a grotesque distortion in order to justify Israel’s actions, suggests that Zionist ideology is in profound crisis.

Michael, here is my response to your last post to me, in case, you didn’t read it:

“z., I wasn’t ‘foisting it on you’. I was reminding you of what you know very well is a fairly familiar position of plenty of zionists.”

You were sticking on me a view (actually indistinguishable from your view, embedded as it was in a polemic of your own) I did not express, presumably because you thought (correctly, as it turned out), the more extraneous verbiage you swamp me with, the more difficulty I will have addressing it.

“How nice of maven to express it here at Harry’s Place just as nice zionists like Gene explain why poor little Israel is just doing what reasonable nation states have to do.”

I am not Maven, or Gene, or Fabian. In your last post (your imputing to me the views of Maven) you raised the issue of settlements. Well, that is indeed a problem, which merits discussion, but it is probably more detailed than my wrists can cope with now.

But, briefly, I think Jewish east Jerusalem should and will stay, the Jewish quarter of the old city retained by Israel. Ariel is the main problem. I have some sympathy with the view that the settlements post-’67 constituted ‘colonialism’, but, again, I do not think it ‘as simple as that’, for various reasons, not least of which I think it perfectly just for Jews to wish to settle in all parts of eretz yisroel and understandable that they did so when they had the chance. However, now, except for Jewish east Jerusalem, most should go.

The reasons I think the latter I will be happy to explain when my wrists are a little rested.

“”Z.: “I think he means that you only (allegedly) identify or assert your Jewish-ness negatively, in contradistinction to the Jewish state of Israel, Zionism or those sympathetic to either.”

“Rosen” Ah, Z., (or Fabian) you’ve become Gilad Atzmon.”

Well, given your ability to transmute me into Fabian or Gene, it comes as no surprise you may work your magic and transform me into Gilad Atzmon.

“Rosen: Excellent. This indeed is what Gilad has been patiently trying to explain to the likes of me. Good, glad that’s been sorted out.”

a) I didn’t say it of ‘you’, Michael, I said what I think Fabian meant by ‘asaJew’.

I gave the example of a Bolshevik Jew, and the hypothetical example of a Jew who only defines his Jewishness negatively. Analogous to a Christian Jewish convert, perhaps.

But, congratulations, the more your impute to me what I did not say, the more you exhaust my ability to address it.

b) since when does the (alleged) coincidence of some element of what one (allegedly) says make one into someone else allegedly saying it?

Even a stopped watch, as they say, is right twice a day. Could one not allege there is a coincidence of view between you, Atzmon and Israel Shamir? Does that make you either?

“a) I didn’t say it of ‘you’, Michael, I said what I think Fabian meant by ‘asaJew’.”

Although, once again, I am only going on what you’ve told me.

“I can think of many Jews I’m very, very fond of.”

Ho ho Mikey – some of your best friends eh??

Sid, I am not taking your word about the presence of anti hate Muslim posts here.

Give us a sample of some or shut the fuck up.

Zin “The attempts to emotionally blackmail critics of Israel are pretty desperate. This ‘Toby’ nutter posts a comment by another nutter called ‘Michael’ that he read on another forum:

Michael(UK) “Wed, 07 Jan 2009 23:01:38 GMT
I don’t think my opinion will change tomorrow. Now be a good Jew , toddle off and gas yourself.”

Yea, I posted this, Zin.

It’s good example of the kinds of people who support your anti-Israel agenda.

If all you can in this is “emotional blackmail” the you are worse than a nutter. You are a hate filled asshole.

Michael is Jewish, so unsurprisingly he can think of many Jews he’s fond of, including himself no doubt. Which was the point he was making, you ridiculous crank.

Of course, it’s possible he may be a raving anti-semite, in the same way it’s possible that you may be a perfectly normal person who’s just having an off-day. But in the absence of any supporting evidence, neither contention is very likely, is it?

“hate-filled arsehole”

Who exactly am I hating??

Maven–

It seems I have to re-state for the record that I harbour absolutely NO Islamaphobia in my body or thoughts. (…) I have said MANY times that ordinary Muslims (Joe The Muslim if you will) just want to live in harmony with us. There are some in the Muslim community who do harbour hatred towards Jews …

Come on, say it once and for all — you have a Muslim friend.

Nothing in the Jewish/Israeli community compares with the hatred and bile we see not only from press.tv but also various Islamist web sites in the UK. Compare MPAC UK with HP for example.

Likud member Moshe Feiglin has compared Arabs to monkeys, Rabbi David Batzri has called them beasts and asses and the scum of snakes, Rabbi Dov Lior has forbidden Jews to employ or rent houses to Arabs, Rabbi Shmuel Eliyahu has called for a genocide of Gazans in response to Qassam rockets…

And we’re talking about statements to the mainstream media.

Zin, who the fuck are you and why are you speaking for that nut case Michael Rosen?

Zin “Michael is Jewish, so unsurprisingly he can think of many Jews he’s fond of, including himself no doubt.”

Who gives a fuck what he says he is.

Trotsky was a Jew but that didn’t stop victimizing his own people during the Soviet civil war period.

It was only after Stalin was after him that he began to see antisemitism in the Soviet State.

Michael is another one of those deluded “Jewish” Marxists who think antisemitism will never touch them.

And you are stupid jerk, Zin.

Shmuel – “the story has now disappeared from the Telegraph online.”
Incredible but true.

Too stupid to read or just another mendacious Zionist?

Whatever, the Telegraph are standing by their story. Here: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/israel/4162193/Gaza-medics-describe-horror-of-strike-which-killed-70.html

Concerns had been growing that Zeitoun had witnessed massive civilian casualties after surviving members of the Samouni clan reached Gaza City three days ago.

According to Mr Shaheen, the death toll was as high as described by the survivors.

Hasbara Buster

“Come on, say it once and for all — you have a Muslim friend.”

Must be that guy “Yusuf” you love to impersonate.

Question is does Maven have an Argentinean “friend?”

Your comments about what Jews said about this or that doesn’t interest anyone here.

The only subject you are qualified to talk about is antisemitism in Argentina. Tell us about the bombing of the Jewish center there.

So Donna they are standing by their mendacious story.

Is there any independent evidence that it is true?

How could there be at this time you cretin? Israel refuses to allow journalists to visit the scenes of its crimes.

Donna’s dream of Israeli massacres are just that dreams.

This however is not dream:

“Rockets fired from Lebanon hit Israel”

By Tobias Buck in Jerusalem, Ben Hall in Paris and Harvey Morris at the United Nations

“At least three rockets fired from Lebanon hit northern Israel on Thursday morning, raising fears that a second front could open up with Hizbollah, the Lebanese Shia group, when Israeli troops are engaged in a massive offensive in the Gaza Strip.

It was not clear, however, whether it was the Shia group that fired the rockets, which left three Israeli civilians lightly injured. Lebanon said it was trying to determine who fired the rockets, and that it was committed to the truce with Israel.

Israel responded with an artillery barrage aimed at the rocket launch site. The government has already reinforced its troops along the northern border, as a precaution against a possible Hizbollah attack, but stresses that it does not seek war with the Lebanese group.”

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/69a96f66-dd64-11dd-930e-000077b07658.html

Any bets on how long before someone like Donna claims that Israel is guilty of war crimes for trying to stop rocket attacks from Lebanon?

Donna

“How could there be at this time you cretin? Israel refuses to allow journalists to visit the scenes of its crimes.”

Donna doesn’t kow the difference between an alleged crime and a crime. And she calls me a cretin, the Jew hater.

Go post on Press TV. Their playing music that is more to your liking.

The Donna Jew hater is back.

“Your cretinism has nothing to do with your Jewishness, you prick. And I certainly don’t hate you, you inconsequential little turd. Pity you, yes.”

It has to do with Israel’s Jewishness you lying sack of pig manure.

“More on the “alleged” crime here”

I am not impressed.

The Guardian not above printing falsehoods about Israel had no correspondent there. The so called correspondent was a Gazan informant.

Doesn’t give one confidence in the impartiality of the report.

Of course, don’t let that stop you and your Hamas comrades from calling for the murder of Jewish children world wide, you Jew hating maggot.

How quickly one gets promoted in the Zionist Hate Arena. Simply because I called YOU out for your stupidity I am a Jew-hater. You asked for more evidence, I supply it, and now I’m a member of Hamas calling for the murder of Jewish children worldwide. Get a sense of proportion you clown. Whoops I forgot; Zionists don’t understand “proportionate”, do they?

The Guardian not above printing falsehoods about Israel had no correspondent there. The so called correspondent was a Gazan informant.

Please allow me to re-iterate my previous comment;

How could there be at this time you cretin? Israel refuses to allow journalists to visit the scenes of its crimes.

Donna wants massacres here are massacres:

“Hamas executes ‘collaborators’, restricts Fatah movement”
By Amira Hass

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1053825.html

“Since the aerial attack on Gaza began, Hamas has sought to suppress individuals it believes endanger the group’s fight against Israel and its hold on power in the Strip, as well as public morale. Prime targets include Fatah members, people convicted or suspected of collaborating with Israel, and “common” criminals.

“Hamas rules with an iron fist even now,” said one resident. A political activist who says he supports neither Hamas nor Fatah said that given the difficult conditions created by the ongoing shelling and ground invasion, Hamas is likely to try to prevent collaborators or those suspected to be from working with Israel.

Since the operation began on December 27, Hamas operatives have executed several people it classified as collaborators. Members of the group have confirmed the executions took place, and said the victims had admitted giving information to the Shin Bet security service that resulted in the deaths of Palestinians, or had already been sentenced to death by a Palestinian military court but the sentences were delayed for various reasons.

Independent sources said that among the dead were those not known publicly to have been collaborators, as well as others long suspected of cooperation with Israel, or those arrested and later released.

Estimates of the number of suspects executed range from 40 to 80, but amid the prevailing conditions shelling, fear of walking the streets and media blackouts it is virtually impossible to verify the numbers or identities of the dead.

Executions are carried out secretly. In Rafah, for example, at least some of the victims were killed in a caravan erected in the area formerly occupied by the Rafiah Yam settlement, and the victims’ relatives were invited to take away the bodies.

Even in the current conditions, Hamas is continuing to arrest those it suspects of criminal activity or Fatah membership, many of whom were arrested on the eve of the IDF operation and fled detention when the shelling began. No one knows where the detained are being held.

Independent sources and those linked with Fatah say Hamas’ common methods include confiscating cell-phones, beatings, house arrest and firing at a suspect’s legs.”

“Whoops I forgot; Zionists don’t understand “proportionate”, do they?”

You got one thing right I am a proud Zionist, and you are a proud Jew hater.

As for the rest of your rambling it’s not worth getting into a spitting contest with someone like you.

PS I don’t understand this bit;

“Your cretinism has nothing to do with your Jewishness, you prick. And I certainly don’t hate you, you inconsequential little turd. Pity you, yes.”

It has to do with Israel’s Jewishness you lying sack of pig manure.

Why would the fact that Israel is a Jewish State make you a cretin? I don’t see how they’re linked. Israel is Jewish. You are a cretin. Both statements are true, but one doesn’t cause the other, surely?

As for the rest of your rambling it’s not worth getting into a spitting contest with someone like you.

And there I was thinking we were starting to hit it off, just the two of us.

Missing you already you little clown x

“Zionists don’t understand “proportionate”” Donna

Unlike Hamas which called for the murder of Jewish children world wide.

Unlike al-Assad action’s in Hama

Unlike Saddam who gassed the Kurds because he was angry at some terrorist attacks.

Unlike the Soviets which sent whole populations to Siberia and murdered millions of people.

Unlike the Sudanese government

Unlike the Algerian govnerment going after the Islamicists

Unlike the Chinese Communists

Unlike the Brits who bombed Dresden

Unlike the Americans at Hiroshima,

Unlike the Japanese in China

Unlike the Germans everywhere

Unlike the Islamicists

Everyone understand proportionality except the Jews.

You are a piece of work, Donna!

Donna is getting as incoherent as a third grade teacher trying to apply logic.

So now you are comparing the Israeli crimes in Gaza in response to rocket attacks to the crimes of Saddam;

Unlike Saddam who gassed the Kurds because he was angry at some terrorist attacks.

Did you really want to do that? I’m going to stop now, you’re embarrassing yourself and no doubt your hasbara instructor will be wanting a few words with you shortly. Let’s do this again some time, it’s been fun.

Toby,

Are you the chap who said on an earlier thread, “Britain should remain a White nation, and Griffin sees this. I’m proud to vote BNP and help save our country”?

If you’re not, you might consider changing your screen name a bit.

Donna is full of her Leninist tricks.

“So now you are comparing the Israeli crimes in Gaza in response to rocket attacks to the crimes of Saddam;”

I am comparing Israeli repsonses to those of Great Britain and any other country that you think is a model of ethical behavior.

You said, asshole, that Jews don’t understand proportionality in war.

I showed that very fiew wars have been fought proportionally.

Now, go fuck youself you Jew hating pig.

Enquiry
“Toby,

Are you the chap who said on an earlier thread, “Britain should remain a White nation, and Griffin sees this. I’m proud to vote BNP and help save our country”?”

is this a joke?

I am part black, part white and I also have native American ancestry.

“If you’re not, you might consider changing your screen name a bit.”

let him change his. Toby is my name and you can shove your Leninist tricks up where the sun don’t shine, bro!

Toby,

My apologies. The poster using the name ‘Toby’ I had in mind posted on the thread ‘Nick Griffin now has “no time for anti-Semites”’, which appeared on Harry’s place four days ago. As Toby is a rare name and the thread was recent, I thought you were probably the same person.

“As Toby is a rare name and the thread was recent, I thought you were probably the same person.”

Not a rare name in the US.

Toby

Be careful of doctors. Only two signatures are required to section you.