Harry's Place

It’s an old tradition.

Interesting, isn’t it, that the yobs waving Palestinian flags about don’t, err, look Palestinian. It’s just another excuse to trash the place, to commit Iconoclasm for Iconoclasm’s sake. In 2000, they’d have been bricking in a local McDonald’s instead.

Now all I want to do is ‘bouy’ Israeli goods..

By the way the video appears to be from Belfast not Dublin.

It must have been the accents but I could not understand what the haters were saying.

Can someone clarify their words for me?

Sounds like “Boycott Israel” – repeated many times.

Damn those pesky protesters, they really struck zionism a knock out blow.

If anyone wants to find me I will be burrowing inside a tree trunk to try and escape from this world-destroying kick in the bum.

:-(

I think they’re saying ‘Buy Palestinian goods’

“Can someone clarify their words for me?”

They are chanting “Boycott Israeli Goods”.

“Can someone clarify their words for me?”

“Buy cod, it’s really good!”

Something about eating more fish, I think.

This is from a Slugger O’Toole blog, see more here:

http://sluggerotoole.com/index.php/weblog/comments/good-god-gaza-and-gonzo/

I suggest a hat tip for them perhaps David ?

Thanks Ross and others for the clarification,

and Brett :-)

After the 5th viewing, I agree that they are probably saying ‘Boycott Israeli goods’, but it’s almost totally indecipherable.

Can someone clarify their words for me?

I think it’s “Boy cock is really good”. It’s a Catholic thing, presumably.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=iUf-DcUIETs&eurl=http://sluggerotoole.com/index.php/weblog/comments/good-god-gaza-and-gonzo/

Memo to flag burners.
Take some lighter fuel.

That was hilarious.

Is this what George Galloway means by shutting down “Israel shops”?

usual HP smears

teacup

folk

Proletarian solidarity it seems is less important than the opportunity to commit a bit of vandalism, and engage in a bit of nationalist fervour. Workers of the world: fight fight fight!

Marx would be turning in his grave.

The difference between this event and what the Nazis did, is that the Israelis could have turned on a boom box playing techno music, and started dancing along with the chants of these ridiculous poeple

you mean – sinn fein/IRA supporters dont like us???!!! Damn – there goes the moral high ground. apparently kiddy fiddlers and serial killers dont like us either, so the shinners will feel right at home.

Dave Rich, perhaps you could email georgegallowaydotcom@gmail.com and ask him if this is what he meant. He’s stopped replying to me unfortunately.

I call for knee cappings all round. Scum picking on a soft target…

Next British guy I see around here will get beaten.

(Sorry David, maybe it is best we postpone the beer).

um, Fabian, if you described these fellows as British to their face you’d be the one getting beaten…

Anyway, I thought you Zionist types believed in a thing called the ‘Jewish People’ of which presumably both you and David T are members…

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=iUf-DcUIETs&eurl=http://sluggerotoole.com/index.php/weblog/comments/good-god-gaza-and-gonzo/

Clearly, they don’t have the E-Z-Burn flags available in good Islamist shops everywhere.

As someone of Irish decent I am appalled at this and other numerous other examples of anti-Jewishness in Ireland.

I can only speculate that since the only Irishman to ever realise his dream of a free and united country was Chaim Weizman, the first president of Israel, (something the Irish still haven’t achieved), his success infuriates the failed nationalists.

Solo! Hay lapa no ya, Solo! Boonowa tweepi, ha, ha.
Han, mah bukee, keel-ee caleya ku kah. Wanta dah moole-rah? Wonkee chee sa crispa con Greedo?

Mentioned in the Slugger article is that these PIRA loves Hamas scum went on a direct action at Belfast M&S “over their close relationship with Israel. ”

I know GG and RR has specifically come out against boycotting M&S so this action must be extreme even for the Stoppers.

What is the supposed excuse for this idiocy – does M&S stock more Israeli food that other stores or is it just the Marks (Jewish) name ?

M&S knickers used to be made in Israel, but these days they seem to be made elsewhere. Egypt last I checked.

M&S sell gefilte fish. Its not kosher though. I don’t know if that puts it onto the fuckwit’s list or not. Some of the SS wanabees seem to be alleging that dead sea chemicals exploit the West Bank but I thought the main plant was at the South end of the sea inside the green line.

I bought a load of Dead Sea Soap in Jericho whan I was there in October – you couldn’t get away from it in the shops there and in Bethlehem. Obviously the West Bankers weren’t boycotting it.

Honestly these idiots are beyond belief.

Of course it is at the south end. Dead Sea chemicals go back to the 1950s.
Newsflash: the green line has been void, dead, expired, it’s an ex-green line since 1967. It was a armistice line, as in ceasefire. When the firing started, all bets were off.

Chaim Weizmann wasn’t Irish, tho he did spend quite a bit of time in Manchester, which isnt that far away.

Youre thinking of Chaim Herrzog who was Irish-born and was president of Israel but wasnt the first of the type.

There does seem to be a bit of a thing with the Irish and Jew-hatred. I remember working in construction in London in the ’80s and being struck by this. Of course, that was the heyday of plastic pogue-style paddywhackery, so you werent allowed to mention this in polite company. This current stuff doesnt surprise me, anyway.

‘Herzog’. Sorry

“um, Fabian, if you described these fellows as British to their face you’d be the one getting beaten…”

Weiss, and I thought that you are from Great Britain, ergo British.

“Anyway, I thought you Zionist types believed in a thing called the ‘Jewish People’ of which presumably both you and David T are members…”

I will think about it after I punch my British.

Thanks Weiss. Of course it was Herzog.

um, Fabian – I’m not one of the people in the video, so I dont understand your point….

And see Ulysses passim for Irish anti-semitism and its glorious literary rebuttal.

Sorry Weiss, I thought that *they* are from Great Britain, ergo British.

FYI, Fabian, the people in the video belong to a group of people called ‘Irish Catholics.’

all the same, I like you, so please dont start going around trying to find an Irish Catholic to punch. Promise me, ok?

Umm Weiss, I am from a group of people called “latinos in Israel”. I am still Israeli though, and I would be in the receiving end of those British who call themselves “Irish Catholics”.

So punch the British, punch the British, punch the, punch the, punch the British.

/satire of course.

They are indiscriminate fuckers those “Irish Catholics” British Terrestrians in any case. I say zap the Earth.

Actually the scum doing the “direct action” are an Irish Republican sect (more extreme than Sinn Fein) called “eirigi”.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89ir%C3%ADg%C3%AD

excellent! you realise we could be at the start of a whole new bitter ethnic dispute between Belfast Shinners and Argentinian new Olim in Tel Aviv! oglaigh na eireann! ze tov ze ozen!

There used to be a fine Irish poet who wasn’t much of a friend of Israel, though: Tom Paulin. Does anybody here know if he has written something about the conflict lately? Does anybody know what fringe party he belonged to, if any?

“There used to be a fine Irish poet who wasn’t much of a friend of Israel, though: Tom Paulin.”

Tom Paulin isn’t a fine anything. Except for being a very fine utter twat. And he worked very, very hard at cultivating that genuine Irish persona of his, so he did.

Apropos:

http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/Bombers-in-Gaza-march-are.4864374.jp

Sinn Fein’s affection for Hamas isn’t anything new, btw. Adams himself was over here recently and met with Hamas PLC member Ayman Daraghmeh. Of course, big Gerry way back when said his greatest hero was Robert Mugabe, so he has form on sucking up to scumbags and psychos. I guess he finds a common language with them.

“excellent! you realise we could be at the start of a whole new bitter ethnic dispute between Belfast Shinners and Argentinian new Olim in Tel Aviv!”

Well, for starters, you could return the Malvinas. Just… I don’t know, park them in Haifa’s port or something.

Tom Paulin is the descendant of settlers, isn’t he?

He used to be in the Workers Revolutionary Party, or its forerunner.

the ingratitude! During the Falklands/Malvinas war, Irish Republicans amusingly took a staunchly pro-Galtieri line.

The sodding Wolftones even had a silly song with the following chorus:

‘With the Empire tumbling down, let no Paddy back the crown!
Las Islas Malvinas Argentina!’

Honest…

Paul is correct in identifying Paulin as a twat. A mad twat. He is one of a small group of bleating ‘literati’ with mad, staring eyes who obsess about Israel and write for the London Review of Books, which no-one reads. Fortunately they don’t let him on the telly very much nowadays because he has a tendency to advocate killing jews which is considered a little bit outre in meedja circles.

The stall pictured in Castle Court, Belfast is about three minutes walk from where I work. Indeed, some of my colleagues, good far leftists all, took time off to participate in that demo. Utterly depressing.

I’ve never bought anything from the stall before, but certainly will now. Time for a face pack.

“Sorry Weiss, I thought that *they* are from Great Britain, ergo British.”
Northern Ireland is not part of Great Britain (an island) but it is part of the UK. So strictly speaking you could say they are not Brits.

I am sure they would attack anyone who said they were British.

Maybe the sinn feiners and the Hamas could go to the malvinas together and create a utopian society based on hating everyone. It would take them quite a while to build a rocket made out of sheep shit that would reach Buenos Aires.

Yossiuk at 2.11pm, “Boycott Israeli Goods” repeated over and over.

Personally I prefer Brett at 2.17pm, “Buy Cod it’s really good”.

Makes me really proud to be Irish……., NOT.

Does anyone know what these products are please? I want to go out and buy some. Thanks.

I actually prefer Derek Mahon, Paul Muldoon or Hugh Maxton, but Paulin’s early and non-political poetry wasn’t altegether bad. Curiously, some ten or fifteen years ago, he wrote a very favourable review of Anthony Julius’ book on T.S. Eliot’s anti-Semitism. He surely changed his mind about many subjects, but it would be interesting to know how and why.

George Orwell at 4.42pm. No George, it’s actually the opposite, they attack if you call them Irish.

JamesJoyce – If it is the stall I’m thinking of then it sells beauty products. It also (sometimes) has a particularly attractive girl operating it.

Thanks Django, but I’m a wee bit old for the cailin, beautiful though she may be; also she couldn’t bring me home to Mother, I’m not Jewish, but I am Irish…….., so even if we don’t have a religion in common, we do have an …ISH in common. (-;

Here’s Paulin’s response to being called an antisemite

http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2003/jan/08/internationaleducationnews.highereducation

I’ve head him speak, and he is a total twat.

Oh he speaks, as well as writes, ah shure those gobshi**s are the worst kind. Stick to the writing Paulin Laddybuck, stick to the writing……

Attacking a kiosk at a mall? Aren’t they brave warriors! Bet they sat around planning it for days. And it really does sound like they are chanting “boy cock is really good!”

“Maybe the sinn feiners and the Hamas could go to the malvinas together and create a utopian society based on hating everyone”

They should explore fully the two islands and dig their tunnels in the areas surrounded by wired fence.

This is nothing new. I remember a wave of wealthy Jews who all arrived in Manchester more or less simultaneously in about 1980 after being threatened and extorted by the IRA. One had been shot I think. They are still proudly Irish though in the way they talk about themselves.

There was also a pogrom in Cork in 1930.

Old habits die hard. I blame the Catholic Church by and large.

I’ve head him speak, and he is a total twat

Indeed. An antisemitic tosser.

JJ,

I assumed they were Ahava dead sea mud cosmetics. There is one in the O2 Centre on Fichley Road, yes always fronted by a young, pretty Israeli girl.

B.

There does seem to be a bit of a thing with the Irish and Jew-hatred

Indeed (and the Scots, to a degree; especially the SNP).
Very strange – small nations throwing off the yokes of colonialism and so on; you’d think they might appreciate Jewish history.

The Irish have achieved a free and united country. It’s called Ireland.

Sean Russel would have been very proud of these guys. But I wouldn’t be calling them Brits!

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/article411647.ece

Maybe the sinn feiners and the Hamas could go to the malvinas

No such place.

Barad, as far as I know, there was never a pogrom in Cork. There was a pogrom in Limerick, after which most Jews left the city – many moving to Cork and settling in the Albert Road area, where there’s now a small green space called Shalom Park.

David – Mick didn’t write that post.

Anyway, I thought you Zionist types believed in a thing called the ‘Jewish People’

Taken your medication today yet?

Where are the statements from the Prime Minister and Chief Constables condemning the racist attacks on Britain’s Jews? They were quick enough to speak in defence of UK Muslims after terrorist attacks perpetrated in the name of Islam?

Why the government silence thus far?

Fabian,

“Well, for starters, you could return the Malvinas. Just… I don’t know, park them in Haifa’s port or something.”

En serio, tuve que ser muy diplomatico cuando discutia el topico de Las Islas Malvinas/Falklands con mis primos de Buenos Aires y Bajia Blanca. Fuimos al monumento para los muertos de la guerra en BA y (como usted tambien tal vez) no querrian oir el punto de vista ingles.

B.

Actually the scum doing the “direct action” are an Irish Republican sect (more extreme than Sinn Fein) called “eirigi”.

MMN, to call Eirigi more “extreme” than Sinn Fein would be akin to claiming that Mao-Tse-Tung killed more people than Mahatma Ghandi. Eirigi make Eamonn De Valera look like Edward Carson.

“Taken your medication today yet?”

Your concern is deeply moving. Still, there was a certain logical contradiction in Fabian’s (light-hearted) position, which presumably a man of your own turbo-like brain should discern, no?

Unfortunately I can’t watch this video without laughing now that people have suggested that they are shouting “boy cock is really good”. Someone should put some subtitles on to that effect.

I’m sure there’s another Downfall video that could be made about the events of the last few days as well.

Pangloss,

“Barad, as far as I know, there was never a pogrom in Cork. There was a pogrom in Limerick, after which most Jews left the city – many moving to Cork and settling in the Albert Road area, where there’s now a small green space called Shalom Park.”

Thanks-I stand corrected. Either way, I remember being shocked that pogrom could take place that recently in Ireland, although I guess the blackshirts were marching in England at that time so perhaps not so odd.

B.

It was 1904, started by priests.

…the Albert Road area is still know as, er, Jewtown. The didn’t put much effort in to the nicknames in those days.

Your concern is deeply moving. Still, there was a certain logical contradiction in Fabian’s (light-hearted) position

Care to explicate it?

which presumably a man of your own turbo-like brain should discern, no?

Difficult to discern fantasies.

And it’s Osem.

Oh, fair enough. Look, I was joking, but since you ask, you deserve a reply. Fabian said as a joke that he’d thump the next Brit he saw, or whatever, and said to David T that therefore they shouldnt meet.

This, of course, contains a contradiction, since both David and Fabian are Jews, so its absurd that Fabian would be thumping David T out of anger at British antisemitism. So I was light-heartedly reminding Fabian that you (i.e. ‘we’) Zionists regard Jews as members of the Jewish People, so it would make no more sense to thump David as revenge on Brit antisemites as it would to thump a Yekke as revenge for the Nazis. I think Fabian understood the joke. I hope this is clear.

Regarding Osem, sorry but I’m going to have to try and explain another joke. As you maybe know, there was an old advertising slogan for Osem: ‘Ze tov ze Osem.’ (its good its osem). And as you maybe also know, a stereotype of Argentinian Olim is that they pronounce ‘m’ as ‘n’ and vice versa. So this produces ‘ze tov ze ozen’ (its good – its an ear.) Anyway, all this was really a joke. After all, I’m a Zionist myself – and I even live in Israel. Imagine that!

I wish everyone would stop trashing the Irish. I used to really fancy Dana when I was young. She won the Eurovision song contest with “All Kinds of Everything remind me of You.” Then, alas, she went into politics. Ireland has won it four or five times, I think. I also liked the Nolan sisters, well actually the third one from the left (I’ve forgotten her name.) And then came the Corrs; Andrea is my favourite, but the brother on the guitar is a bit of a bore. Now we have to be content at Eurovision time with Dana International from Israel.

A young Irish Nazi, Sean Russell
On a U boat caused quite a kerfuffle
With a scream and a jolt
He died clutching his throat
The culprit? A badly cooked mussel.

TOM PAULIN 1974

“There used to be a fine Irish poet who wasn’t much of a friend of Israel, though: Tom Paulin.”

Paulin’s of Northern Irish Protestant Christian stock. So’s Richard Seymour, I think.

“Indeed (and the Scots, to a degree; especially the SNP).
Very strange – small nations throwing off the yokes of colonialism and so on; you’d think they might appreciate Jewish history.”

Well, many European nationalist movements have been inimical to Jews of one stripe, or another. Jews as a ‘non-national nation’ (or ‘the chimerical nationality of the merchant’, to paraphrase Marx) often got caught up in the middle in the struggle between popular movements and the elites upon Jews had often depended for protection. In that sense, antisemitism has often been ‘democratic’, at least the type most dangerous to Jews.

An economic down turn, a ‘gifted’ demogogue like George Galloway, et al., and hundreds of thousands of disgruntled, disaffected people, ready and willing to make Jews, of one sort or another, the object of their disaffection.

Also the legacy of Reformation protestant philosemitism and anti-Reformation Catholic antisemitism, transmuted into Northern Irish Protestant Christian pro-Zionism, Roman Catholic anti-Zionism.

Old Wine, New Bottles, to reverse the parable.

Fabian;
‘Return the Malvinas…’. We’d love to, but we’re stuck with them. After 1982 the opportunity is gone, probably for ever.

“There was also a pogrom in Cork in 1930.”

And the famous Limerick pogrom in 1904:

“The boycott in Limerick in the first decade of the twentieth century is known as the Limerick Pogrom, and caused many Jews to leave the city. It was instigated by an influential intolerant Catholic priest, Fr. John Creagh of the Redemptorist Order. A teenager, John Raleigh, was arrested by the British and briefly imprisoned for attacking the Jews’ rebbe, but returned home to a welcoming throng. Limerick’s Jews fled. Many went to Cork, where trans-Atlantic passenger ships docked at Cobh. They intended to travel to America. The people of Cork welcomed them into their homes. Church halls were opened to feed and house the refugees. As a result many remained. Gerald Goldberg, a son of this migration, became Lord Mayor of Cork.”

More here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Ireland

‘Paulin’s of Northern Irish Protestant Christian stock. So’s Richard Seymour, I think’

So am I zkharya, means nothing!

‘Paulin’s of Northern Irish Protestant Christian stock. So’s Richard Seymour, I think’

So am I zkharya, means nothing!

The libanese man mentioned above regards himself as a palestenian, in Denmark stateless palestians is categorized after their place of origin.

Django,

did I say it did? I was simply correcting an error in fact and surmising another.

Fair enough, Weiss. Probably crossed wires – apologies.

Yes, I am very familiar with the Osem ad, but didn’t know about this m/n issue.

Paulin sounds off about Nazis … riiiiight …

I suspect even Graham may have something to say about minimum wage shop workers being terrorized by middle-class thugs.

Well, for starters, you could return the Malvinas.

Five thousand Falkland Islanders would disagree, being resident on a territory which has been a British possession almost as there’s been an independent Argentina and were barely occupied beforehand. They have as much right to self-determination as Israeli Jews.

Joe Briscoe, the son of Jewish IRA man Robert Briscoe, said of the Limerick pogrom that is was “an aberration in an otherwise almost perfect history of Ireland and its treatment of the Jews” (see the website of Ireland’s Jewish community, jewishireland.org). It is also worth noting that the IRA connection with the Nazis was purely opportunistic, as was their connection with the Germans in 1916. “Britain’s difficulty is Ireland’s opportunity”, as the saying goes. I think you’ll find that when the fascist Blueshirts started in Ireland in the 1930s, the IRA were their fiercest opponents.

But don’t let facts worry you. One of the most amusing features of this site is its hypocrisy. You root about for a pogrom that happened in 1904 so that you can experience that delightful feeling of self-righteousness, yet you ignore the continued ethnic cleansing that goes on in the West Bank. Nearly Oxfordian acts as racist bigot John P’s right hand man, yet makes more accusations of antisemitism than anyone else on the site, perhaps even on the planet.

Serious question. Are there laws in the UK an other various parts of Europe preventing the defensive use of pepper spray? Here in Florida, as well as many other states, pepper spray, up to a certain potency, is not considered a controlled (for concealed carry sake) weapon. Same with regard to stun guns. I couldn’t imagine counter-protesting at this type of event without some back-up.

>> You root about for a pogrom that happened in 1904 so that you can experience that delightful feeling of self-righteousness, yet you ignore the continued ethnic cleansing that goes on in the West Bank.

Of course, the two individuals you refer to are commenters who frequently receive condemnation from site authors, and Women in Green type nutters are lambasted by the site authors. Hypocrisy? You said it!

Isn’t “ almost perfect” pretty much the essence of “self-righteousness”?

An “almost perfect” record isn’t hard when your Jewish community has rarely exceeded two thousand individuals.

“You root about for a pogrom that happened in 1904 so that YOU can experience that delightful feeling of self-righteousness, yet YOU ignore the continued ethnic cleansing that goes on in the West Bank.”

Because, like, “we” are responsible for alleged “ethnic cleansing” etc.

“We” all know who “hypocrisy” (an unfortunate name, again) means by “you”.

“Hypocrisy” means, literally, “the wearing of an actor’s mask”, the mask behind which “Hypocrisy” routinely hides.

is it my impression or emotions are making communication difficult in this thread? everyone seems to be a bit over-sensitive.

Not-hypocrisy,

You’re trying hard to make a forceful point, but failing. The implication in a number of the posts was that the sort of appalling behaviour shown in the video was typical of the Irish. I merely pointed out that it was not.

I don’t know what you mean about ‘self-righteous’. I used the quote merely to make my point, which was a perfectly reasonable thing to do in the circumstances. Concerning my use of ‘you’, I apologise. I meant to say “some, but by no means all”, with appropriate changes according to context.

Welcome to Harry’s Place, Sarah.

The implication in a number of the posts was that the sort of appalling behaviour shown in the video was typical of the Irish. I merely pointed out that it was not.

No you did not, Bob. For the umpteenth time, this is an open-blog on which many posters of different political persuasions post. You not only inferred that an Internet page was on a par with events on the ground; but that this number of posts, by John Paluwhatever and Nearly Oxfordian specifically, were representative of the site authors who have, on a number of occasions, both opposed their positions and posted *against* Settler thugs.

Site authors who also did not raise the matter of the Limerick pogrom.

Try getting your smears straight!

I suspect even Graham may have something to say about minimum wage shop workers being terrorized by middle-class thugs.

Well my first thought is that intimidating shop-workers may backfire terribly on such people if it becomes an accepted part of demonstrating (and my second thought concerned what Israeli products I would go out and buy in order to show my contempt for such people – I really don’t want bath salts mind.

I bought some reduced price sharon fruits from Tessa Cohen’s stall today.

Also, funny how this sort of thing starts farcically and progresses to violence.

j.r.: “He is one of a small group of bleating ‘literati’ with mad, staring eyes who obsess about Israel and write for the London Review of Books, which no-one reads.”

Hey, I read the LRB! Bonkers political views, certainly, but good history articles. Just don’t read the letters page is my advice.

Your claim that I suggested the site authors were hypocrites is false. When I said “this site’ I meant the whole consisting of the articles themselves and the comments relating to them. As evidence of hypocrisy may be found among the comments, it was quite proper for me to say “One of the most amusing features of this site is…”. The phrase in no way implies that any specific aspect of the site, in this case the authors, is being referred to. Do you really suppose that I was suggesting that the authors of the site were looking for pogroms that occurred in 1904?

Also, I was using the word ‘you’ loosely, as I have already said, and in the sense that does not mean ‘all without exception‘.

Still, though I can forgive the slander, I simply cannot countenance the violence you have done to the English language. The word is ‘implied’, Alec, not ‘inferred’. I hope for your sake none of the posters who are purists in regard to English usage read your post.

My last post was directed to Alec Macmalapropism

the type of provocation that is mentioned in alec’s link is typical of extremist right-wing groups.

it comes to my mind what I have read about incidents against shops owned by Jews in other parts of Europe. they go there, invent something to provoke a reaction so that in the end they may claim to be the victims and accuse their targets of disrespecting them as costumers, etc, etc, etc… next round: a rally is called to protest against it, the other costumers feel intimidated, etc, etc, etc…

this is a classic, and if average people fail to see that when these rioters harrass the workers of the shops selling israeli products, they are not doing it because they care about innocent palestinians, or even for the palestinian cause, then average people are all getting blind…

“Ze tov ze Osem”

I reccomend their “Parve Chicken soup mix”

Just fry some onions and leeks, a little garlic, add water, and good old Osem, some carrots and potatoes, and don’t forget the lokshen.

Yum.

Not as good as Mame makes though.

’sorry,

“demAgogue”.

Sarah, I recall an attempted boycott of Ariel washing-powder in Egypt.

Oooo, someone’s got his knickers in a twist, Bob.

When I said “this site’ I meant the whole consisting of the articles themselves and the comments relating to them.

From that to this:

Do you really suppose that I was suggesting that the authors of the site were looking for pogroms that occurred in 1904?

Well, yes, your previous statement demands just that possibility.

Also, I was using the word ‘you’ loosely, as I have already said, and in the sense that does not mean ‘all without exception‘.

Hahahaha, this is pant-pissingly funny! You have just admitted to referring to “this site” as the articles and uncontrolled comments in toto. So, either you were not associating the site authors with ‘em – in which case your previous statement makes no sense – or you admit to ranting against a file of H.T.M.L. code, and wish acknowledgement of your intellectual honesty – you strange, strange person.

Just as with dead certainty of the bullying tactic of mocking an Internet user’s spelling being accompanied by a whopper of one’s on, so then say:

The word is ‘implied’, Alec, not ‘inferred’.

Followed by calling me Macmalapropism.

I infer from that that you were accusing me of committing one. Do you know what a malapropism is? Calling me Macmalapropism may be, but what you accused me of committing ain’t.

Those protestors are twats. No other word for them really.

If you took away the chants and the flags you’d take them for football hoolies.

“…Irish…fight fight fight!…”

The Irish are well-known for their phlegmatic temperament and mild character. They are also exquisitely polite, and would never join in a fight without first enquiring whether it is a private or public brawl.

Incidentally, both the Irgun and Lehi drew inspiration from the IRA’s fight against the British imperialists. Menachem Begin wrote about it at length in his memoirs, and Yitzhak Shamir’s underground name was Michael, after Michael Collins, the great Irish patriot.

Not to mention Chaim Herzog actually being from there.

Alec,

The absurd claim that my remarks were ‘pant-pissingly funny’ must be based either 1) on the false notion that I have contradicted myself or 2) on an equivocation on the word ‘associating’.

1. The first quote you have used of mine in your 10:20pm post does seem to contradict the third, but that is only because the first quote has been taken out of context, thus making it appear that I am saying all the contributors to Harry’s place are hypocrites. In the actual passage, I go on to say after the statement you quoted “As evidence of hypocrisy may be found among the comments, it was quite proper for me to say ‘One of the most amusing features of this site is…’. The phrase in no way implies that any specific aspect of the site, in this case the authors, is being referred to. Do you really suppose that I was suggesting that the authors of the site were looking for pogroms that occurred in 1904?”

Hence, I was clearly saying that I did not mean all contributors were hypocrites, and there is no contradiction between the two statements when the first of them is seen in context

2) You began this debate by saying by saying that I ‘inferred’ that the two posters were “representative of the site authors”. But now you are talking about my ‘associating’ the site authors with the two posters, which is an entirely different concept. Merely by saying “the whole consisting of the articles themselves and the comments relating to them” I have in a sense associated the authors with the two posters simply because I have grouped them together; but this is not at all the same as saying that they are representative.

With regard to their being representative, I did not infer any such thing. I have merely cited them as instances of hypocrisy on this site. If I had said “x believes all Muslims should be deported from the UK, but then says…” it would not have in any way implied that x’s view was shared by the authors.

In short, you can regard my remarks as ‘pant-pissingly funny’ only by taking the remark concerning ‘this site’ out of context, or by introducing a new term ‘associating’.

As to ‘implied’ or ‘inferred’, here are a few parts from one of John P’s posts “No, you don’t get it. Islam is, has and always will be redundant to the entire human enterprise. It has virtually no real achievements to speak of… The sheer idiocy, superstition and backwardness chactersing the Muslim world is all that’s left when the wealth and intellectual vibrancy of those who’ve been conquered have been exhausted”.

It is unthinkable that any of the authors on this site would concur with such statements. It is also highly unlikely that anyone remotely familiar with this site would believe that they did. Hence, I assumed you meant ‘implied’, principally because of the improbability of anyone identifying the site‘s authors with John P‘s views. Nonetheless, though you are wrong in assuming I inferred the authors shared John P’s view, if you say that you did not confuse the two words, then I believe you.

Give it up, Bob. You’re a disgusting person and a thug with a keyboard who doesn’t even have the basic honesty to post by a regular handle. Being a narcissist, you will not let one critical comment on the Internet lie but pursues the individual responsible into the ground. For instance, you can shriek about infer/imply, and then falsely call the mistake a malapropism. The rules apply only to the little people.

thus making it appear that I am saying all the contributors to Harry’s place are hypocrites.

Except, of course, I did not say that you did. From the start, I have referred to “site authors”. You referred to “this site” as being represented by those commenters who mentioned the Limerick pogrom and, when challenged to link the site authors to these comments, flapped around with the most tortuous of definitions of “this site”, whilst allowing yourself endless leeway on interpreting mine.

You were “clearly” adopting the fascistic smear of associating whole groups of individuals with certain personality traits, and then bottle it when challenged.

It is unthinkable that any of the authors on this site would concur with such statements. It is also highly unlikely that anyone remotely familiar with this site would believe that they did.

Yet you said “One of the most amusing features of this site is its hypocrisy”. The only way out is for you to admit that you were referring to the nebulous concept of an Internet page as representing a malign force, in which case you’re in the grip of a psychotic episode. If so, I would recommend you seek professional help, now.

But, no, you went on to say, “you root about [...]“. Thus, you’re not referring to a nebulous concept but to individuals, known or unknown. Hey, didn’t you say you weren’t? Hypocrisy!

here are a few parts from one of John P’s posts

Sorry, stopped reading there, Bob. John P has not commented on this thread, so is only relevant if, in response to A, you’re discussing B, and lumping the site authors in with an individual they repeatedly disavow any support for. But you insist you’re not.

You using City Hall equipment?

Alec,

Contrary to what you think, I am not Bob Latchford. I didn’t mention the fact before because I could see you were just angling. It’s not very good manners to employ phrases like ‘disgusting man’ unless you are sure of the person’s identity.

You say “when challenged to link the site authors to these comments”, but I had no intention of linking the site authors to the comments, because when someone states something about a site, they are not necessarily stating something about the authors. If I say “I do not like some of the things said on that site”, the ‘things’ in question may be in the articles, but they may be in the threads. In the thread ‘pruning’, which David T has just put up, David T says “I am quite often embarrassed by the content and tone of the comments on the articles on the site”. Are you saying the comments are not on the site?

“You were “clearly” adopting the fascistic smear of associating whole groups of individuals with certain personality traits, and then bottle it when challenged”. Dear, dear. I was merely being polemical, Alec. As for the bottling it, it is absurd. You know nothing about me, I’m afraid. By making precise my references, I was merely complying with your complaint in regard to my overstating the case.

““One of the most amusing features of this site is its hypocrisy”. The only way out is for you to admit that you were referring to the nebulous concept of an Internet page as representing a malign force…”. To clarify that I didn’t mean the site’s authors in particular, I said “When I said “this site’ I meant the whole consisting of the articles themselves and the comments relating to them”.

Clearly, this is misleading, because text can not be hypocritical, so I should have said “one of the most amusing features of a fair few of the people who contribute to this site is their hypocrisy”. That was ‘the way out’, as you call it, because it makes it clear that I was referring to people not text, and to a section of them rather than all of them. It is called moderating one’s claims, Alec.

But you say “The only way out is for you to admit that you were referring to the nebulous concept of an Internet page as representing a malign force”, which is nonsense. All I had to do was moderate my claims somewhat and my main point is sound. As for the “psychotic episode” part, that’s an old trick, and it only gets a laugh in contexts where someone has made an irrecoverable error, and not merely been a bit polemical.

Alec,

Incidentally, you ask me if I know what a malapropism is. According to my Collins English dictionary, a malapropism is “the unintentional misuse of a word by confusion with one of similar sound, esp when creating a ridiculous effect”.

People certainly unintentionally confuse ‘inferred‘ and ‘implied’, and it is obvious that they do not make the same mistake with words similar in meaning to these but with different pronunciations. For example, no one confuses ‘concluded’ or ‘judged’ with ‘implied’. Hence, it is perfectly reasonable to call the use of ‘inferred’ for ‘implied’ or vice versa a malapropism.

Moreover, you say in regard to malapropisms “Calling me Macmalapropism may be, but what you accused me of committing ain’t”. So you are not only saying that what I accused you of was not a malapropism; you are also saying that calling you Macmalapropism may be a malapropism itself. From this, I think it is clear that you do not understand what a malapropism is. After all, how can what I said ever be considered a malapropism?

Here are some sites that refer to the confusion of infer and imply as malapropisms (the second link is to a blog by Mark Liberman, a professor of linguistics at the University of Pennsylvania)

http://www.uq.edu.au/~pdwgrey/web/essays.html
http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000305.html
http://www.cdtl.nus.edu.sg/UFM/effect/432_c.htm

Thats not Dublin,(Castle Centre off Royal Avenue Belfast) and that is not a riot. That is fuck all, seen better after the fooytball. As regards civil unrest that is a bit tame. The PIRA decided that they had an affiinnity with the PLO and so the, ever media savvy, prods decided fuck that we’ll be the Israelis. Cowboys and indians. Shame on the lot o yez, but fuck all, Besty where are ye?

heh heh, regarding Miss Malaprop, a guy just told me that the acceleration on a Suzy 600 was ‘quite etheral’. The prosecution rests..

Collins was a grass

and he got clipped by his own handlers

think I go to the same hairdresser

and by the way dickhead the lads in Belfast will lay out the matt for you my friend