Harry's Place

Who here is old enough to remember when all really ambitious bank robberies in England were planned with undercover police informants present?

Its just a rubbish attempt to play it down isn’t it?

He is gearing up to bash people who might have the nerve to suggest
-

a. The threat is real.

b. The choice of a synagogue might not be a total coincidence.

One of his motivations will be that it makes Hamas look bad because they pull this kind of shit all of the time.

His other motivation will be to argue against people looking at the anti-semitic elements of contemporary jihadism.

There will be a CiF article linking Israel to these events within 24 hours.

Quite obvious the Plotters of the Protocols are behind all this somewhere.

Them or the Giant Lizards that live in caverns under Denver International Airport.

There will be a CiF article linking Israel to these events within 24 hours.

…hopefully not written by Ben White…

It’s certainly wording from the official that will prick up ears of conspiracy nuts who will assume this was a plot strung along by the FBI on some innocent converts and their friend who were no more than pawns to further the war formerly known as the GWOT. Or something.

Where as the official probably meant the group were under surveillance and wouldn’t have been allowed to do anything even if they had got the capability to do it.

Meanwhile, the blog Ethnic Ashkenazim Against Zionist Israel offers this commentary:

“Not only does blowing up a synagogue where a fund raiser for the Friends of the IDF is being held seem tremendously different from traditional anti-Semitism — I have spent a lot of time in looking at 19th and 20th century anti-Semitic attacks, but all the participants in such a fundraiser should be arrested for aiding and abetting Zionist terrorism.

After the Gaza Rampage no one except a racist Zionist or stooge of racist Zionists could rationally argue that the IDF is anything but a terrorist organization.

It is illegitimate to consider every attack on a synagogue or JCC to be an act of anti-Semitism.”

Ben White is yet another of those self-styled ‘experts’ on the Israeli/Palestinian dispute who appear to think that a few visits to the area -staying in carefully selected places of course -render them the god-given right to pontificate about what should or should not be done.
In line with most of his writings I have come across -poor oppressed ‘freedom fighters’ are misunderstood victims, wrongly branded as terrorists.
At least he’s consistant.

“You idiot!!!!!!!!!!! The synagogue bombing plot is a scam FBI set up like Fort Dix. It’s another thought crime conviction. As usual CAIR condemned them pre-trial.”

From that surreal website.

I think Ben White means the freedom for Islamist or other crackpots to kill Jews.

Israelinurse, I quite agree, but that’s the case with so many of these charmless idiots, isn’t it?

meh and others, at least this lot were under surveillance, meaning that there were enough people to watch them, unlike in MI5 and the Met for two years before 7/7.

Tory, I wouldn’t be in the least surprised if you are right.

“Meanwhile, the blog Ethnic Ashkenazim Against Zionist Israel offers this commentary”

Is it run by HB? I am offering 3:1.
Is it run by Linda? I am offering 3:2.
Is it run by Gert? I am offering 6 to 5 on.

Ben White is someone who Toad of Toad Hall takes his moral compass from, predictably.

But… he’s so tender!

http://www.benwhite.org.uk/2007/01/01/strong/
Ben White
‘Strong’

like the wind that caresses the cheek or blows tiles from a roof

stronger than the tree
rooted in the generations
it doesn’t move
and its branches always bear fruit

strong
like an idea
that rises anew with each youth who
raises his fist and dreams

yellow petals ripple
and catch your hair
so you close your eyes to
breathe

strong like the sun
on your uplifted face
and the cascading water on your back

your fears have nothing compared
with this strength

they are shadows that melt into light

Come on, these dudes probably mixed up the synagogue with the Pentagon. I mean, neither of these buildings is square or rectangular is it?

ok Im going to stick my neck out…I read this story in the NYT this morning and huge alarm bells went off in my head.

I have no doubt whatsoever that these guys were total anti-semitic jihadi wannabe scum. Yet the details so far scream ‘ENTRAPMENT’ at me.

Would these guys just have remained utter scum rather than terrorists if the FBI hadnt offered them fake Stingers and plastic explosives?

Would this sort of operation even result in a prosecution in the UK?

There will be a CiF article linking Israel to these events within 24 hours.

Yep, it’s your chance to play Guardian/Independent bingo: ‘entrapment,’ ‘un-American activities,’ ‘in a democracy people are innocent until proven guilty,’ ‘war against Muslims,’ ‘proof of how the zionists control America,’ ‘O’bomber’s dirty war in Pakistan,’ ‘heroic resistance against zionazi crimes in Gaza’ etc etc

You forgot ‘genocide of Palestinians’, Hasan.

Seismic -well he does apparantly have a degree in English Lit, which of course makes one eminently qualified to analyse the politics of the Middle East.

Yeah, there’s a world of difference between

- a participating informant talking a bunch of ingenues into blowing something up that they wouldn’t other have thought of blowing up; and

- a group of criminals trying to blow something up, but being sold fake explosives by a fake arms dealer.

We’re in category B here.

Israelinurse -
but that means he has an -ology, which makes him an academic, which means he is qualified to pronounce on the Middle East, especially on Israel. And they are only Jews anyway.

This will be spun as though the four ‘innocent’ perps had been set-up, goaded and pressured into buying fake explosives, and then encouraged to attack a jewish target.

Entrapment or some such.

Ben White is an English literature graduate who feels sufficiently well qualified to tell Jews what they believe (cf. theologically false Zionism).

Has the blog post changed at all?

Has anyone seen today’s Indie?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/exclusive-how-mi5-blackmails-british-muslims-1688618.html

Yet the details so far scream ‘ENTRAPMENT’ at me.

Then allow me to scream back: IT’S NOT FUCKING ENTRAPMENT. Entrapment is a legal defense with specific legal requirements that are not met here. Calling it entrapment is just a way of minimizing the crime. Knock it off.

Alec – the post has not changed but Ben White appears to have deleted the two comments on the post – the pingback to Seismic Shock and a comment which accused him of going too far this time. (This is ironic as he contributes to Comment Is Free)

The ping back is fair enough, but as for t’other one… he really is a cockweasel, ain’t he? I’d love to know if his pa’ really is a vicar.

Robert West, maybe?

“Five Muslim community workers have ACCUSED MI5 of waging a campaign of blackmail and harassment in an attempt to recruit them as informants”

To the scum at that racist rag, accused = proved where members of this community (and the – to them – thugs of MI5) are concerned.

S
21 May 2009, 5:33 pm

This is hardly a case of a crackdown on curb crawling being mounted as PR.

You can’t “entrap” someone to commit such heinous acts by the mere offer of money and furnishing of means unless they are very strongly disposed towards carrying out the heinous act but for having the means.

The ACTUALLY planted the car bombs outside the synagogue and took delivery of the Stinger.

Its just that the explosive was fake as was the Stinger http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1185228/Four-Muslim-extremists-arrested-plot-bomb-synagogue-shoot-planes.html

Unfortunately this is pretty standard fare for the ‘letters to the editor’ section of most every Liberal blog out there. When something happens to Jews either it’s an a) false flag operation by the CIAMossadJewBankingNeoconCabal or b) Exaggerated nonsense blown out of proportion by the MSMZioDominated Media.

It was the group, on their own, who initiated contact with someone who they believed could obtain surface-to-air missiles and explosives but turned out to be an informant. There was no inducement by the feds.

The choice of a synagogue might not be a total coincidence.

I heard parts of the indictment from the USA and they state that the perps had possession of many synagouge photos while they cased each place. Obviously synagogue photo collectors. The fact that one of them talked about putting bullets into Jews heads was also a slip of the tongue while drunk, presumably

Of course much of the far left blogosphere would be outraged by the conflation of ’synagogue’ with ‘attacks upon America’, not that they don’t earnestly wish both to burn, but that it intimates a bit of that ‘not in my name’ twaddle.

Alec

Thats perfect

Only the Indpendent or Guardian would see this as a case of heinous Islamophobic profiling and harassment.

And the director of the ‘community organisation’ (are Journalists so thick never to probe a bit more into exactly what kind and for whom) declaring this is racist and islamophobic. It has destroyed all social cohesion in this country by targetting young men for whom the ONLY THING IN COMMON IS THE FACT THAT THEY BELONG TO A PARTICULAR FAITH ARE SOMALI AND HAVE STUDIED ARABIC ABROAD.

At least the security services are getting their act together.

These young men travel a lot for community workers. Its really not that common for young men who are not Islamists to study Arabic abroad and even less common for young muslim men who work for a Muslim community group (I am assuming here the Independent was very careful not to tell us who the community group was for, but given that they would have asked and most such community groups are now explicitly faith based and that the Independent intentionally witheld this information, I know I am right).

Indeed the group was most probably funded by a preventing violent extremism initiative, engaging with young muslims, so good the security services are taking their job seriously and trying to prevent violent extremism.

Only a complete moron could not see that young Somali men studying arabic abroad (and I bet good money that it was in Yemen or Saudi Arabia not lebanon) were not at risk of being recruited to violent extremism.

Of course alarm bells should ring when they travel to Saudi arabia or Djibouti, those well know tourist hotspots.

Indeed young Muslim non-Arab males studying Arabic in Saudi Arabia and marrying there is a pretty sharp indicator of potential involvement and recruitment to Jihadism.

The mere fact that the security services sought to recruit them to spy on jihadi groups is a brilliant realisation of exactly who is most closely connected to them and most at risk of becoming (or already being novice recruits).

I can’t think of a sounder strategy.

As for the harassment well one case if it is true may have overstepped the mark.

But as for the profiling boo hoo. I am really tired of this fucking shit. I have been detained an questioned for many more hours than these whiny brats.

Oh I wonder why.

Well I have a funny name and a passibly ethnic eatern european-middle eastern look especially with a tan and when you see the numerous repeat stamps in squiggly writing indicating a series of visits to countries that right in a squiggly fashion well I am mightily pissed off but I have to accept that security services are not anthropoligists, orientalists or arabists.

I have even been refused permission to fly to New York, because of an overzealous interpretation of a non-visa irregularity, which could have been checked.

At least that was the reason but after four hours of questionning over the squiggly visas. I know it was not that,

I have been travelling between the US and the Middle East and Asia, for 30 years and it gets harder and harder.

I have had endless personal and travel plans disrupted or cancelled.

I am even now routinely given the third degree traveling between Latin America and the US and Europe, including recently travelling from Venezuela to the UK trying to get back to see my very sick father.

He died while I was in transit being delayed for 24 hours, having missed a connecting flight because i was detained for Questioning in Miami.

And who do I blame? Islamists.

Really this indulgent shit by the liberal media drives me bonkers, endlessely fabricating examples of islophobia where non exist endlessely stoking greivance.

Well the rest of us are aggrievied too as our lives have also changed.

Many non-muslims lives have been impacted directly far more than the incidents in Israel and Palestine which touch most muslim british lives not at all, yet we are supposed to accept that Muslim anger is because of their greivances.

Yet anti-semitism rises and is normalised in an exponential degree to alleged muslim greivance as the distorted obsession with Isreal is forced by neurotic Obsessive compulsives, to the centre of domestic political concerns.

We have reached a clearly destabilisng tipping point and it is not going to be pretty.

The scandalously irresponsible racism of the psychotic anti-war anti-semites and their proteges the Islamists, and the cosseted and protected misunderstood Jihadis has already created a situation that in every other country I can think of would have created a hideously violent backlash already.

It has boosted the fortunes of the BNP.

God help us, we can’t rely on the stupidity of the BNP and the general inertia, social passivity and general common decency of the majority of British people forever.

I hope it holds but i see know sign that the political class have the stomache for dismantling the incipient islamist shadow state, or that the liberal anti-Zionists have smugly crossed the Rubicon into overt anti-semitism, now they have their target in their sights, frightened and on the run.

I am not prepared to sacrifice the Jews for the imagined social harmony that will follow.

The choices are getting much starker thought in a way perhaps we should be grateful for the fact that so many anti-Zionists have dropped the mask.

They can no longer hide behind their shield of anti-racist righteousness. Their spears of declamatory racism in their targets are blunted and their thrusts have lost their force at least for a minority, and I fear the anti-racists are now in a minority while the charlattans still occupy the stage of public piety.

Well I have chosen the ‘chosen people’ (what an obviously ancient trope to turn the victims into victimisers).

I was once some kind of ‘anti-Zionist’ now or what it is worth, I will stand by the Jews

Please. Four low-life losers babble about how they want to “commit” jihad, some other guy at their mosque decides he can make some money from the FBI & organizes the whole “plot.”

Where did these clowns get their weapons? Oh, yeah, the FBI informant.

You people are all such scaredy-pants you’ll believe anything.

Ben White appears to be courageously deleting comments to his post asking him to define the freedoms he believes the law enforcement officials in New York have threatened. Brave man, that.

David, the freedoms of Jews not to die?

Does anyone have a low-down on the synagogue itself? Does it, for instance, have a Zionist line – not a problem – or is this another Chabad House style attack?

grand ad

yes it’s a hobby for a few muslim males like trainspotting.

The more intellectually inclined are more inclined to go to a strict Wahabbi madrassa in Saudi arabia, while the more philanthropically minded are more likely to travel to Taliban areas to do community social work.

Please. Four low-life losers babble about how they want to “commit” jihad, some other guy at their mosque decides he can make some money from the FBI & organizes the whole “plot.”

You people are all such scaredy-pants you’ll believe anything.

I recently posted elsewhere that if someone were to show that Hitler was a closet Muslim then there would be people speaking out as to how Hitler was setup. You would!

Craig Murray -

Now we have the “Groom a Terrorist” programme. Find four angry and frustrated black men, tell them they can blow things up and offer to give them the means.

Instant terrorists.

Brilliant. A whole new approach to criminal justice.

The guilty party is the person who offered the means to commit a crime, rather than the person who actually carried out the crime.

What a strange world Craig Murray must live in.

I’ve just posted this comment on BW’s blog and await with interest to se if he will respond to it or delete it.

“If there had been a bombing, would you have “understood” it Ben?”

M. Bouffant
21 May 2009, 7:28 pm

Absent being offered vast sums of money to do so, you can’t entice someone an act of such extreme violence against persons they don’t know unless they wanted to do so anyway but for access to the weaponry of choice.

And if the grievance was Afghanistan and Pakistan, why lay bombs beside a couple of synagogues as opposed to say, a US courthouse or other structure connected to the government?

Anti-zionist anti-racists will believe anything except the obvious, I suppose.

testing

What a strange world Craig Murray must live in.

Given he has to make stuff up that isn’t in any of the reporting it’s not surprising.

Don’t you people know that every single arrest for terrorism in the USA since 9/11 has involved an FBI agent entrapping some gullible souls who had absolutely no connection to al-qaeda? I imagine that you do and simply post this crap to show your fealty to the Anglo-American national security state.

Penny Pemberton obviously has no idea what home-grown terrorism is and how al-Qaeda ‘Prime’ is an inspiration for these acts rather than controlling them. Thankfully this also means the current crop are hopeless fantasists but it makes them no less dangerous. For example the Tiger Tiger bombing could have been very nasty had the bimbling idiots not screwed up so badly. The real danger lies in the future as there may be more competent individuals out there learning from this.

The idea that the FBI shouldn’t try to stop terror plots by trying to hoist the terrorists on their own petard is ridiculous. Clearly in this case there was intent to cause death and destruction via a terror attack as the terrorists had no clue their kit was inert.

Penny, why don’t you post that to White’s blog… oh, he’s just closed comments… just as I was about to say this to Comrade Proyect:

The good thing about being an unrepentant Marxist in a Western society is that one never does need to face up to the repercussions of such policies.

Louis, does your facial hair still make you look like a twat?

A monsieur Proyect on Ben’s blog says:

“an FBI agent contacted him to convince him that it was better to blow up synagogues than go fight in Afghanistan, which was his original intention.”

Is there any evidence that this is the case.

He died while I was in transit being delayed for 24 hours, having missed a connecting flight because i was detained for Questioning in Miami.

Metta, condolences on the loss of your father. I hope you have plenty of good memories of him.

According to the Daily Mail:

“In November, on a trip to a meeting of the Muslim Alliance of North America in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, Cromitie is said to have declared that ‘the best target was hit already’ – referring to the World Trade Center, destroyed in the September 11 attacks of 2001 – and to have added: ‘I hate those motherf ******s, those f****** Jewish bastards … I would like to get a synagogue.’”

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1185228/Four-Muslim-extremists-arrested-plot-bomb-synagogue-shoot-planes.html

These wretched “Zionists”: they will insist on being easier domestic targets than faraway Afghanistan, and they will threaten Ben White’s and Penny Pemberton’s freedoms by being targeted by other than Al Qaeda.

But I am curious as to what White Pater thinks of his poet son’s journalistic endeavours.

Are we to be treated to an article on the above in Third Way?

meta,

my condolences on the loss of your father.

Don’t you people know that every single arrest for terrorism in the USA since 9/11 has involved an FBI agent entrapping some gullible souls who had absolutely no connection to al-qaeda?

Pemberton is not only a liar but an idiot.

Please. Four low-life losers babble about how they want to “commit” jihad, some other guy at their mosque decides he can make some money from the FBI & organizes the whole “plot.”

No, four criminals were out looking to buy ground to air missiles and asked the wrong guy who then informed the FBI. They had already conspired and were guilty of a crime before the FBI was ever notified.

“Penny Pemberton obviously has no idea”

Might as well stop there – you’ve said it all right there.

Clearly Obama’s aspiration to people the jails of America with captured Al Quaida operatives will make prison-made jihadists even more common.

“Clearly Obama’s aspiration to people the jails of America with captured Al Quaida operatives will make prison-made jihadists even more common.”

Perhaps they should be set free then.

If you let me know your address you can have them…

morgoth, Zkharya

Thank you. I am sorry that kind of slipped out. I wasn’t trying to be histrionic but my blood boiled when I read the Independent article on how thes poor young boys (who fit all criteria for potential Jihadi recruits) were subjected to vile islamophobia when they were detained for 3 hours each on their way to a wedding in Saudi Arabia and visitng Granny in Djibouti.

Jesus fucking Christ no-one has a right to fly. the risk is so real (where are thos people claiming it is all hysteria again) and so high from British citizen Jihadis that everyone is subjected to increasing scrutiny delays and the hours stuck in hell hole airports that can result from this.

and why is this? who caused this? this liberal MSM puffed up sense of greivance over necessary threat avoidance are they so fucking totally narcisistic that they think that any minor negative encounter with anyone happens soley because they are Muslim.

Are the most agreived blind as well as stupid when they walk through an airport and see an old disabled woman’s wheelchair being swabbed for explosives asfter she’s been lifted out and plopped on a chair?

In fact most profiled ‘islamophobic’ stop and searches take place around heathrow. As an epidemiological fact there is a high percentage of brown people living there.

A higher percentage of these people I believe are Sikh or Hindu but we don’t have a daily diet of their grevances at being stopped do we?

Ben White is a rabid ‘hate Israel’, ‘hate Jews’, person posing as a writer.

He claims ’sources in occupied Israel’ and such and seems only to have a single agenda. (Probably an unpleasant rejection by a Jewish ‘friend’).

I am sure that many of those that he consorts with must be somewhat embarrassed by him. Constantly writing putrid rubbish about Jews and Israel and their perceived sins, his ‘expansive humanity’ seems not the see or hear of Darfur and Sri Lanka.

If only these terrorists could have heard a speech of appeasement and apology like this from “Kid” Milliband http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1186078/Iraq-war-Crusades-damage-Britain-David-Miliband.html I’m sure they would have abandoned their Stinger plan and just concentrated on Jews.

mettaculture @1:26 -well said.
I regularly get hassle at Manchester airport when I come in -for some reason they’re very upset by the fact that my British passport wasn’t issued in Britain -and my daughter has been stopped and searched by British Transport Police purely on the basis of her appearance, but we don’t take it personally -it’s part of modern life today when one travels.

“Would this sort of operation even result in a prosecution in the UK?”

Yes. The one I remember is that of Eamon Smullen (OIRA) in the early 1970s, the difference being that the police actually offered him real ammunition. BTW, this was the firdt case in the UK where taped evidence was allowed.

“…Would these guys just have remained utter scum rather than terrorists if the FBI hadnt offered them fake Stingers and plastic explosives?”

Yes, but they had a choice not to act like utter scum, didn’t they? They took the Stingers which meant that it’s more likely than not that they intended to use them. Which means that they broke the law.

“Would this sort of operation even result in a prosecution in the UK?”

I hope so, but I am no law expert

“…Would these guys just have remained utter scum rather than terrorists if the FBI hadnt offered them fake Stingers and plastic explosives?”

Yes, but they had a choice not to act like utter scum, didn’t they? They took the Stingers which meant that it’s more likely than not that they intended to use them. Which means that they broke the law.

“Would this sort of operation even result in a prosecution in the UK?”

I hope so, but I am no law expert
BTW I love your blog!

Here’s a fit-up in the Yu-Kay.

Oh, this good and bad cop business. Really good cops don’t encourage really good terrorists – the kind who want to blow up kuffars in synagogues or whereever, but don’t know how to do it – with dud explosivesi and so on. That’s the job of bad cops, who might even give them real explosives, in controlled amounts of course.

The really good Guardian and Independent types in the Pemberton mode really don’t like these really good cop machinations, especially if the really good terrorists can be shown to be really good anti-Zionasties – victims of the Orientalist machinations that really bad cops dabble in, as they, the really good terrorists quite rightly help themselves to the goodies that the Orientalists provide them with as they sojourn in the country of adoption they dream of harming.

Meanwhile, Pemberton and company, you’re in the wrong blog to help your really good friends.

Meanwile HP needs a dozen Habibis to nails the bastards – don’t take the violent language too literally – to the wall. .

.

I woke up this morning, amazed that I had neither died from swine flu nor had I been beheaded or blown up by islamic terrorists.

The state will have to find a new bogeyman to scare the children into being good democratic sheep er, I mean, citizens.

Penny Pemberton is 100% right.

It is the police/FBI that should be prosecuted for feeding the antisemitic fantasies of these (and presumably many other) alienated young men and providing them with weaponry.

Though, of course, if it had been a group of Jews laying FBI-loaned explosives outside of mosques, the likes of Internationalist and Penny would have been oscillating between righteous outrage at the crime, and delight at the propaganda opportunity, so fast they’d be emitting x-rays. Thank you, both, for your principled stand.

I woke up this morning, amazed that I had neither died from swine flu nor had I been beheaded or blown up by islamic terrorists.

The state will have to find a new bogeyman to scare the children into being good democratic sheep er, I mean, citizens.

Penny Pemberton is 100% right.

Both of you are utter idiots.

Last year in Toronto the security services arrested a group of Jihadists ( mostly Pakistanis) who were organising mass attacks on british shopping malls with the intent of killing 1000s. The ringleader was just sentenced a few weeks ago to 15 years in prison.

And the year and a half before that they arrested yet another group of Jihadists ( mostly Pakistanis) who were planning to invade parliament and behead the Prime Minister.

Leftists Canada-wide scoffed and laughed, decried the entire affiar a sham and a set-up, but were then caught with BOTH feet in their mouths when the events In New Delhi unfolded.

But then what could convince people who believe 911 was an ‘inside’ job that the threat is real.

Just think, one minute Penny P. and Internationalist are at the local mall, gov’t pay cheques in hand , and in the next instant both are strumming a harp.

Internationalist – how lucky you were were not to be in the twin towers on 9/11 or on a London tube that 7/7 morning. One could almost believe that neither of these things not happened, you cretin. How about you and Pemberton trying your luck in a mornng market in a typical Iraq city or a shi-ite mosque? Of course, as you expired, you could the utter the words “Orientatalist scum’. To which, I would happily add, “Amen.”

metta: So sorry to hear about your father.
“see an old disabled woman’s wheelchair being swabbed for explosives” This is exactly the process my mother went through at Belfast airport last year on her way back from my son’s wedding there.

Last year in Toronto the security services arrested a group of Jihadists ( mostly Pakistanis) who were organising mass attacks on british shopping malls with the intent of killing 1000s.

—

NY Times, September 25, 2008
At Canada Terror Trial, the Accused Take on a Less Sinister Cast
By IAN AUSTEN

BRAMPTON, Ontario — The story that first emerged about the 18 men and teenagers, all Muslims, who were arrested in and around Toronto in June 2006, was deeply disturbing. Police officials and prosecutors told of plots to bomb government offices in Toronto and Ottawa as well as a nuclear power station, and of a planned attack on Parliament with the aim of capturing Prime Minister Stephen Harper and decapitating him.

But as a judge in this Toronto suburb prepares to release the verdict on Thursday in the first trial of a member of the Toronto 18, as the accused have come to be known, the group has taken on a less sinister cast.

Charges were dropped this year against seven of the defendants. And evidence presented at the first trial suggests that the group was long on inflammatory talk about plots but short on the means and methods to carry them out, and that it was aided — and perhaps provoked — by paid police informants.

From the first terrifying charges outlined by prosecutors to the gritty, often comically deflated details that have emerged in court, the case of the Toronto 18 seems to fit a well-established pattern in terrorism prosecutions. Whether the result of trumped-up charges, conflicting demands of intelligence agencies or difficulties of trying cases where evidence is withheld by governments looking to protect their sources and methods, numerous terrorism trials in the United States and Europe have similarly foundered over the years.

full: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/25/world/americas/25canada.html

Israelinurse

Oh yes one of those passports I had one of those. It might not have a machine readable bar code in it as well (which would make going to the US impossible).

I am not advising you mind, but it has been duly noted by yours truly that an extremely effective way of dealing with this is to drop it in the washing machine. its best if its mushed up everywhere except the really important page with photo etc. Works a treat, of course you have to buy another but even though they are swingeingly expensive now, its probaly worth it.

Mettaculture -gosh, that’s a bit radical for me! No, I have a different tactic; I always travel in very high heels, so when they get snotty I draw myself up to my full height (an unimpressive 1.64m without the heels) and look snobbishly down my nose at them making ‘eccentric British lady dealing with the tiresome peasants’ noises in my poshest accent possible.
I’ve had ” Are you quite sure you’re really British?” (on account of my foreign-sounding name) to which I replied “Probably more than you are.” Worked a treat.

So why do you call yourself IsraeliNurse? Surely short and stocky British nurse who seems to travel lots and loves Israel would be more more fitting my dear old fruit?

Because I’m Israeli and a nurse, just like it says on the label, but also happen to have British citizenship. And I’m afraid stocky is not remotely appropriate.

“Brazil police disrupt neo-Nazi bomb plot”

Associated Press , THE JERUSALEM POST

“Police disrupted an alleged neo-Nazi plot to bomb at least two synagogues in southern Brazil and are looking into whether the group has international ties, officials said Thursday.

Police seized Nazi literature, knives and three homemade explosive devices earlier this week they said were to have been set off at least two synagogues in the city of Porto Alegre, according to police Inspector Paulo Cesar Jardim.

“I have no doubt that we have aborted a major tragedy,” he said.

Fourteen unnamed men were detained but released pending an investigation. They had no links to four men arrested Wednesday in a plot to bomb two New York synagogues, Jardim added.

Police have been investigating the Brazilian group, which calls itself “Neuland,” since it was formed by Brazilians and unspecified foreigners in 2002, Jardim said.

It was composed of at least 50 “extremely intelligent, well-organized and very dangerous criminals who prey on Jews and gays in the name of racial purity,” he added.

Officials are exploring possible ties between the group and other Neo-Nazi organizations in Brazil, Argentina, Chile, Great Britain and France, he said.

None of the seven synagogues in Porto Alegre, home to a Jewish community of 13,000, took any extra security measures on news of the plot, said Henry Chmelnitsky, president of the statewide Rio Grande do Sul Jewish Federation.

“We can’t ignore these groups, and we must always be alert, but we cannot, and will not, panic,” he said.”

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1242212440754&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FPrinter

RE: I woke up this morning, amazed that I had neither died from swine flu nor had I been beheaded or blown up by islamic terrorists.

Too fuckin’ bad.

Is there any crime against Jews/Israel or America/the West that puerile pathetic penny pemberton and her acolytes won’t attempt to rationalize?

“Though, of course, if it had been a group of Jews laying FBI-loaned explosives outside of mosques, the likes of Internationalist and Penny would have been oscillating between righteous outrage at the crime, and delight at the propaganda opportunity, so fast they’d be emitting x-rays.”

Hilariously funny – thanks for that ;-)

Charges were dropped this year against seven of the defendants. And evidence presented at the first trial suggests that the group was long on inflammatory talk about plots but short on the means and methods to carry them out, and that it was aided — and perhaps provoked — by paid police informants.

And the other 11?

You have to cast the widest net possible when individuals are talking about mass murder.

To boot, the authorities are rightly nervous and reluctant to allow these nut cases to persue their activites for fear they might actually kill.

When to step in and put a stop to terror planning is a very big call and the Canadian authorities erred on the side of caution.

But the fact remains these individuals were intent on murdering, and were very motivated to do so.

Just because every last culprit wasn’t tried, convicted and sentenced in less than 48 hours, their plans weren’t real and had no basis?

You seem to forget the ringleader got 15 fucking years in prison, and so was up to a little more than just shoplifting.

And now appears that if the authorities don’t allow jihadists to execute their plans and commit mass murder, then their plans were all a conspiracy trumped up by security services.

And, of course, when acts of mass murder happen, we then blame those same authororities for not acting in time.

You are an idiot, Pemberton.

“Just think, one minute Penny P. and Internationalist are at the local mall, gov’t pay cheques in hand , and in the next instant both are strumming a harp.”

Are you sure that there are harps in the hot place?